Who has experienced a pitman arm breaking?

[WILDHORSES]

I can say first time I've seen this and would agree heating a pitman arm not a good idea. This type of brake would have to be considered extremely rare. Replace the the arm and i would not give it a second thought.

 

[barronj]

The pitman arm shattered, I'm putting a new one on to replace it. I'm not asking how I can weld it back together.

I understand what you're saying though.

 

[bmc69]

It looks as though they are two different taper angles? Causing stress point to failure....its just me looking at a picture obviously...that could be scaaaary..

It looks like that to me too......?:?

 

[PaveBronco]

I don’t want to beat the dead horse on the heating subject but that’s the cause. That’s a forged part, forged to make it stronger, tougher, and slightly malleable to resist any shock loading. It doesn’t go through any surface hardening, say like a crank. Without getting too technical and because I’ve forgotten most of what I learned in Collage, whoever heated that, basically undid all the properties that the forging process imparted to the material, making it extremely brittle.
But this is a pic of my new WH adjustable drag link, and after DirtDonk’s comments:

(If it was that full-size vs EB bit I mentioned earlier, I think the mismatch would have been larger. Large enough in fact to have caused the dust boot to get crushed as the tapered stud was pulled too far up into the too-large hole.)

Did they sent me a full size rod end, it looks like the fullsize and didn’t think too much about it until I noticed the split boot and this thread.

 

[bk005]

You've built yourself a death trap. God help whoever you meet on the highway.

I was recruited to be an expert witness in a near identical case resulting in a victim becoming a paraplegic. In your wildest imagination you can't begin to imagine the shitstorm you can bring upon yourself. Posting this account just crucified you in the event of any future incident.

Man you sound like Geraldo Rivera, eat a snickers.

 

[PaveBronco]

re: "Without getting too technical and because I’ve forgotten most of what I learned in Collage"

Pave, please don't post such disinformation. A few of us here work designing and machining forgings on a daily basis. I do a modest amount for Boeing and Airbus landing gear parts as well as professional racing gear boxes. Not about to be suggesting online anything regarding failure mode of life-critical components.

Dude Snicker STAT!!!

 

[savage]

PaveBronco
I had the same problem with the WH drag not fitting my 74 drop pitman arm.I work with WH they sent me another drag end ,it did the same thing.WH were great to work with on this problem and tried to fix the problem,I ordered the three way adjustible and ended up keeping the tierod two way and sending back the drag bar.

 

[.94 OR]

PaveBronco

The photo that you attached appears that you have a lower tie rod end used at the pitman arm. The forged and machined hole appears about in place to accept a drag link when used on the passenger side of the vehicle in a horizontal position. Or, on the old ram-assisted F250's this is where the ram assist would tie in.

If you are comparing apples to apples, is the taper and depth the same on the end you show as compared to a stock EB drag link at the pitman arm?

 

[xcntrk]

Dude Snicker STAT!!!

 

[PaveBronco]

PaveBronco

The photo that you attached appears that you have a lower tie rod end used at the pitman arm. The forged and machined hole appears about in place to accept a drag link when used on the passenger side of the vehicle in a horizontal position. Or, on the old ram-assisted F250's this is where the ram assist would tie in.

If you are comparing apples to apples, is the taper and depth the same on the end you show as compared to a stock EB drag link at the pitman arm?

.94 OR
I agree, I thought it looked like the Passanger side TRE from a fullsize, it came in the WH box with the drag link. I'm going to give the guys at WH a call.

 

[DirtDonk]

Yes Pave. Give us a call stat! ;D
Looks like you're in the same boat as savage, and I saw them checking a bunch of ends, so see what they found and if we can get you another one that will fit.

Looks from here like you have a stock type pitman arm, but possibly a full-size?
Are you running a stock box or a 4x4x2 box that came with an arm by any chance?
Reason I ask is that, although yours appears to be a stock EB arm, the angle at the end looks more like the reversed full-size angle. I could be wrong, or it could be the angle of the pic, but it doesn't hurt to square this away ahead of time.

If it's a full-size arm, the tapered hole is too big for a rod-end meant for an EB. Even the '66-'75 upper draglink rod-end is going to suck up too far inside.
If it's still a stock arm though, then we may just have sent you an improperly sized rod end.

Calling in is the best thing to do.

Paul

 

[bk005]

 

[DirtDonk]

Darn drive-by-wire. Should have added a pitman arm, crossover steering and a trackbar!

Paul

 

[broncodriver99]

Yes Pave. Give us a call stat! ;D
Looks like you're in the same boat as savage, and I saw them checking a bunch of ends, so see what they found and if we can get you another one that will fit.

Looks from here like you have a stock type pitman arm, but possibly a full-size?
Are you running a stock box or a 4x4x2 box that came with an arm by any chance?
Reason I ask is that, although yours appears to be a stock EB arm, the angle at the end looks more like the reversed full-size angle. I could be wrong, or it could be the angle of the pic, but it doesn't hurt to square this away ahead of time.

If it's a full-size arm, the tapered hole is too big for a rod-end meant for an EB. Even the '66-'75 upper draglink rod-end is going to suck up too far inside.
If it's still a stock arm though, then we may just have sent you an improperly sized rod end.

Calling in is the best thing to do.

Paul

I'm in the same boat as well. I bought the drag link about a year ago but only put it on a couple of months ago and haven't driven it much since I did. I have a modified stock draglink that will be going in this weekend to replace it. Sounds like you guys may need to come up with a different way to offer an adjustable drag link.

 

[DirtDonk]

...Sounds like you guys may need to come up with a different way to offer an adjustable drag link.

Well, maybe, but the problem just cropped up as far as we know, so it's been working well for years. Again, as far as we know. And it's not necessarily the "design" in this case, but the wrong size end in the box. It's very possible that these smaller ones are for fitting up to '76/'77 pitman arms. But until I see the measurements, that's just an educated guess.

I hate to use the oft joked about phrase "the first we've heard of it.", but I'm pretty sure savages call a week or two ago was the first.
The ones we've used hereabouts and on our own rigs, and have personally seen on other's rigs, have fit fine.

We actually did come out with a different design in the Clydesdale system, where all it takes to change the pitman arm taper is a quick change of an end cartridge. It may not be to everyone's taste, but that's what we were working on for quite awhile until just last year.
We've also been working on a more universal upper end for our general replacements, but that was more for length and type of stabilizer shock mount bracket, than for any known problems, or the size of the tapered stud, which would have remained the same no matter what the other design criteria.

The setup you and the others have is (or was when the parts we bought were correctly labeled anyway!) a very good way to come up with a larger-than-stock diameter rod, with the different stock sized rod ends to fit the four different pitman arm sizes.
What we have to fit with the upper draglink rod ends are:
1. Early '66
2. Late '66-'75
3. '76/'77 only
4. '78/'79 (and related mid-seventies truck arms)

The lower draglink end can be the same in all cases, since we can use a single bar for that.
In that area we only have to accommodate slightly different lengths.

As far as we knew it was working fine in all instances. Perhaps one issue is that you've had yours so long and we're just now hearing about it. If so, there may be others as well, that have not called in either.
Not blaming you by any means. Just pointing out the length of time it sometimes takes to get feedback at our end.
So anytime you have something you don't feel is quite right (even if it's working at the time) don't hesitate to call the vendor (no matter which one) and ask for details and express your concerns.
If it's normal, we'll tell you and explain why. If something's not right, it's not right, and needs to at least be questioned.

So please take a picture of yours too if you can, and post it up or send the image in to sales@wildhorses4x4.com to let us see what's up. And correct it if needed.

Thanks

Paul

 

[broncodriver99]

Well, maybe, but the problem just cropped up as far as we know, so it's been working well for years. Again, as far as we know. And it's not necessarily the "design" in this case, but the wrong size end in the box. It's very possible that these smaller ones are for fitting up to '76/'77 pitman arms. But until I see the measurements, that's just an educated guess.

I hate to use the oft joked about phrase "the first we've heard of it.", but I'm pretty sure savages call a week or two ago was the first.
The ones we've used hereabouts and on our own rigs, and have personally seen on other's rigs, have fit fine.

We actually did come out with a different design in the Clydesdale system, where all it takes to change the pitman arm taper is a quick change of an end cartridge. It may not be to everyone's taste, but that's what we were working on for quite awhile until just last year.
We've also been working on a more universal upper end for our general replacements, but that was more for length and type of stabilizer shock mount bracket, than for any known problems, or the size of the tapered stud, which would have remained the same no matter what the other design criteria.

The setup you and the others have is (or was when the parts we bought were correctly labeled anyway!) a very good way to come up with a larger-than-stock diameter rod, with the different stock sized rod ends to fit the four different pitman arm sizes.
What we have to fit with the upper draglink rod ends are:
1. Early '66
2. Late '66-'75
3. '76/'77 only
4. '78/'79 (and related mid-seventies truck arms)

The lower draglink end can be the same in all cases, since we can use a single bar for that.
In that area we only have to accommodate slightly different lengths.

As far as we knew it was working fine in all instances. Perhaps one issue is that you've had yours so long and we're just now hearing about it. If so, there may be others as well, that have not called in either.
Not blaming you by any means. Just pointing out the length of time it sometimes takes to get feedback at our end.
So anytime you have something you don't feel is quite right (even if it's working at the time) don't hesitate to call the vendor (no matter which one) and ask for details and express your concerns.
If it's normal, we'll tell you and explain why. If something's not right, it's not right, and needs to at least be questioned.

So please take a picture of yours too if you can, and post it up or send the image in to sales@wildhorses4x4.com to let us see what's up. And correct it if needed.

Thanks

Paul

Hey Paul. I understand. I kinda blame myself since I took so long to install it which is why I never called about the issues.

I pulled the whole front end out a couple of weeks ago for a gear swap and am finally getting around to installing the WH 2.5" lift that I have had for a couple of years(was for another project). Replacing a TBP 2.5" lift. Anyway, can't get you a pic of it installed as it is all laying on the floor now.

My comment was more directed at helping you guys clear up any problem that may be happening. Please let me know if there are any measurement I can take that will help figure out if there is an issue. I will say that mine looked just like PaveBronco's as far as the TRE being too far into the pitman arm. I am running a stock Bronco manual steering pitman arm. I also had issues very similar to Savage when installing it. It did not fit either of the drop pitman arms or stock '80's model arm I had so I bought a stock arm from TBP which it then bolted up too when I held it just right, but am not crazy about the angle of the rod ends which is why I decided to just go with Tom's drag link.

 

[DirtDonk]

Sounds good. No prob.
I don't have the specific measurements here, but if you get the chance to call the shop I think Mark has them handy. Or if he doesn't have them written down, perhaps he can get a dial-caliper on them so you can compare.

If you don't have time to call, I'll check on Monday for you.

Paul

 

[barronj]

/hijack.

Got my new pitman arm from Tom's yesterday, and it looks a lot different than the one I took off! I already tossed the old one in the trash, but the immediate difference is the amount of material around the splined end. With the old one, I had to grind it down flat 1/8th on either side to get the pitman arm puller around it for removal. This new one is much smaller. Also, the old one was run way down on the splines, and this one is sitting closer to the nut end by 1/8", maybe as much as 1/4".

Fits more snug, has a ford logo embossed, couldn't be more impressed.

Almost all buttoned up, let you know how its new road manners are.

 

[thegreatjustino]

The one you took off was a power steering pitman arm. The one you got from Tom's sounds like a manual pitman arm. They are much less beefy than the stock PS pitman arms. Should still work fine though.

 

[barronj]

The one you took off was a power steering pitman arm. The one you got from Tom's sounds like a manual pitman arm. They are much less beefy than the stock PS pitman arms. Should still work fine though.

well shit...