Thinking of a 351W swap, things to look out for??

[lars]

The fact is, there's no reason to change an EB more than necessary, except to be a wildebeest jumping into the croc infested river with the rest of the herd. Independent thinking must be stamped out here. Sad. Thankfully I did my 351 swap before the idiotic orthodoxy of EFI and Explorer crap being declared the only way to do a swap. I've learned from experience in the 70s-80s that I don't need or have a want for Saginaw pumps, huge tires, lift kits, Cheby heater blower motors, EFI, HydroBoost, Cherokee wiper blades, dual exhaust, headers, and an endless list of crap that doesn't improve the go anywhere do anything vehicle. There were a few things Ford could have done, but didn't want put in the effort. Among those are the 351, better shocks, an electric wiper system that doesn't need a big box around it, and a spare wheel carrier that rattles loose in no time. I fixed those. My Bronco can take on real trails, drive cross country, plow through 2'+ snow, and maneuver better than almost anything in congested streets, parking lots etc. All that while looking better than any other 4X4. My advice is to think for yourself.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Pat yourself on the back for drilling down through the bs better than anyone else and likewise doing a better job than anyone else on deciding which updates makes sense and which are to be rejected. Based on what you write, it would appear that you closed the door on new ideas a long time ago.

My Bronco does everything I want it to and I never asked anyone, especially people like you, for advice. I did the Explorer swap, EFI, etc before most even knew that it was an option. I take it on extended trips multiple times per year, it never lives on a trailer or goes to a car show. Didn't consult anyone for props about which if any of the mods were a good idea. And it can do everything you just described. Just runs, year after year.

When someone else comes along much later, we offer advice on what's been done. Presumably anyone with the ability to think critically can decide if those options make sense for their goals. Including v belt vs serpentine, EFI, gas monotube shocks (a mod we both have done, for similar reasons) etc.

 

[nvrstuk]

Well said Lars. When I first read his post and even after rereading it I was looking for the clue that jcky was being sarcastic...
but then realized he wasnt and wasnt in the mood to respond. Thx Lars!

 

[nvrstuk]

Its a bit funny because as I wheeled in the '70's & '80's I was looking for improvements for my Bronco so it could be more "able", more dependable and take me where I wanted to go. I looked for my "5 spd letter" the other day from about 1980 that I wrote to 3 or 4 magazines and to Adv Adapter (and got one response from a magazine... looking for a lower first gear and OD and a heater that would actually thaw some of the built up snow on my windshield wipers and wondering if they could be lowered closer to the heat source and a list of other things Ford engineers did NOT do 54 yrs ago... this on an 8 yr old EB w/50K miles... 250K miles later I'm still improving on FORD engineering shortcomings... lol

Glad I'm willing to step forward about 50+ yrs in technology so my Bronco can now go where it tried to before... but couldn't.

Hard to believe how "stuck in a rut" people get.lol

 

[toddz69]

The 700R4 transmission doesn't work with my J shift so I am wondering if it will work with an Atlas?

Yes, it will work great with an Atlas. In fact, a 700R4 adapter to an Atlas is a lot shorter and much less $$ than a 700R4-to-Dana 20 adapter.

Todd Z.

 

[toddz69]

Its a bit funny because as I wheeled in the '70's & '80's I was looking for improvements for my Bronco so it could be more "able" and take me where I wanted to go. I looked for my "5 spd letter" the other day from about 1980 that I wrote to 3 or 4 magazines and to Adv Adapter... looking for a lower first gear and OD and a heater that would actually thaw some of the built up snow on my windshield wipers and wondering if they could be lowered closer to the heat source... at times it was our only car and as a DD it got me to work every day.

Glad I'm willing to step forward about 40 yrs in technology so my Bronco can go where it tried to before...

Hard to believe how "stuck in a rut" people get

It's only a rut if you're trying to get out of it . Different strokes for different folks. You, Lars, and I (and jckkys) are all old enough to have driven our Broncos back in the day when we were changing points, wrestling manual steering boxes, and stomping on manual 4 wheel drum brakes. At some point, I swapped in a Duraspark ignition and the march towards greater reliability and longer maintenance schedules had begun. We're all critical thinkers regarding the mods we do to our trucks and we've arrived at combinations that are very reliable, work well, and are driven frequently. They're no less 'Bronco' than anyone else's trucks on this board.

Stefan - do what you'd like with your truck based on the sound advice you read on this board. There's more than one 'right' way to achieve the end goal of what you're trying to achieve.

Todd Z.

 

[nvrstuk]

... and if you go Atlas you won't be replacing D20's so you'll come out ahead moneywise in a few years...

D20's were great t-cases for 6 cylinder or small V8's with 4.10 gears and 28" tall tires when they came out 50+ yrs ago. Some 5 decades later they are getting tired. Torque kills them. Not just from the engine but from lower gearing, 100% lock-up differentials, big tires and places we drive our Broncos compared to 50 yrs ago. Torque kills D20's.

Most buy an Atlas for the lower gearing which multiplies torque even more...

..and what Todd just said...

 

[Stefan]

It's only a rut if you're trying to get out of it . Different strokes for different folks. You, Lars, and I (and jckkys) are all old enough to have driven our Broncos back in the day when we were changing points, wrestling manual steering boxes, and stomping on manual 4 wheel drum brakes. At some point, I swapped in a Duraspark ignition and the march towards greater reliability and longer maintenance schedules had begun. We're all critical thinkers regarding the mods we do to our trucks and we've arrived at combinations that are very reliable, work well, and are driven frequently. They're no less 'Bronco' than anyone else's trucks on this board.

Stefan - do what you'd like with your truck based on the sound advice you read on this board. There's more than one 'right' way to achieve the end goal of what you're trying to achieve.

Todd Z.

I am taking it all in.

I still remember driving the Bronco with manual drum brakes after doing legs at the gym. That was always an exciting event;D

Good news about the Atlas, when I looked at the adapters I didn't see where it said that it would work for an Atlas.

I still have to figure out what replacement power steering unit to get.

 

[ntsqd]

I've done the dual v-belts thing in the past. They are never the same length! Ever! Sometimes they are close and sometimes they are not. And that's only if you buy them as a so-called "matched set." If you buy them as individual belts they won't even be close to the same length. With two belts of very slightly different lengths one is basically idling and the other is carrying the load. This is the very good reason that the OEMs developed the serpentine belt systems.

My first vehicle with a serpentine belt convinced me. One belt is the way to go. Means that you only need to carry one spare, because guess what? It fits ALL of the accessories! I now have 3 serpentine belt vehicles and the Bronc-up has an Exploder front dress ready to go on. Immediate post purchase prep is to buy two quality belts from my local real auto parts store, one as a spare and the other goes on the engine. Our CTD now has about 75k on it since we bought it. Thinking about that I should probably change the belt. Buy a new one and put the spare on it just for GP. Most tensioners have a 1/2" drive square hole in them, and what do you know? I just happen to equip each rig with a 1/2" drive breaker bar for the lug nuts (& unit bearing bolts in the case of the CTD). Takes more time to get the belt routed right than any other part of the operation. NOTE: get another belt routing sticker and put it somewhere easy to see while you're doing that job!

I'm going to guess that my '96 FSB and its 5.8L are the same engine as you have in that '97 F-150 although I think that a true '97 MY truck should be a 5.4. Smog legal performance is, .....um....., best described as 'stately'. ;D
Lots of torque considering, but you do have to plan your passes (my FSB has 4.56's and 35's)
If you can move all of the sensors across then I don't see why you couldn't put the '97 EFI bits in a more typical, known to clear the EB hood OEM EFI intake and run it.
My PS pump occasionally whines. When I've had enough of that or it dies I'll be buying the Desolate Motorsports Saginaw PS pump bracket and possibly their whole kit. Will depend on if buying the pump from Lee PS will get me a better pump or not.
With the '96 front dress you can jump from a 95A alternator to a 130A alternator just by buying the right one. It is not listed for the F-150, but it IS listed for the E-250 with this engine. https://www.rockauto.com/en/moreinfo.php?pk=277189&jsn=1197

 

[Stefan]

This should be the correct oil pan to use on the Bronco with the 351W? I just want to make sure.

https://www.jegs.com/i/Ford-Performance/397/M-6675-A58/10002/-1

 

[ntsqd]

Is the pan on the engine now known to not fit? Bronc-up came to me with the 351 already installed so I've not had to learn about this.

OEM F-series oil pan:

Linked oil pan:

 

[Stefan]

Man o man... there are SO many options for you... good luck! lol

Can you tell us more of what you "want" in this build? Like... do you like power? Are you wheeling mud or rocks or ?? What gas tank do you have (easier for EFI) or if doing mud with Exploder front dress you need an electric pump but you NEED a pressure reducer for it. Trans desired? No need for a D60 rear but a D60 frt yes- pro's/con's... 47 more questions but tell us more about your dreams with this build.

All great feedback on all the posts so far.

I missed your D60 comment before but have been going back and reviewing this thread as I build up parts.
You said no need for a D60 rear? Do you think a 31 spline 9" is good enough? But a D60 front? I haven't found any D60 front ends, do you have any sources with the correct width?

The rear tank is stock but I would like to upgrade to a larger rear tank. The other tank was bought about 25 years ago from Wild Horses if I remember correctly (but I could be wrong). The venting system and all the lines need to be replaced. I am trying to figure out the best way to clean up the engine compartment and then what protectant to put on it? I am almost thinking about separating the cab from the frame and doing the entire undercarriage.

I also need to rewire this thing. I'm not sure on what kit is the best. Lots to figure out still.

 

[ntsqd]

I suspect that a D60 front will have to be purpose built.

I'm not rock crawling my FSB and my local 4x4 shop owning friend is concerned that I was thinking of not going 35 spline in the rear D60 that it is about to get. He felt that 30 spline D60 axles aren't going to be strong enough long term for 4.56's and 35's.
According to what I could find online those splines measure 1.300" OD where the 9" 31 spline axles measure 1.330" OD at the splines. I'd rate them pretty close to the same strength at the splines anyway.

 

[Stefan]

Thank you, that is very interesting. That will save me some money for the rear axle.
Any axle manufacturers to avoid?

 

[svobronco]

A 700R4 works fine with a J-shift, you just have to make your own shifter bracket.