Alignment - What should I ask for?

[diggs00]

Driving to alignment shop in near future.

#1 goal is to find my current caster angle. Is there anything else they might not capture that I need to know?

1976 Bronco

 

[75MIKE]

You should get all the info you need. I've never seen a read out that didn't have the actual measurements along with the correct spec range next to it.

 

[DirtDonk]

What Mike said. Get it all if their machine covers it. Including the rear axle measurements too, just to make sure it's not bent.

And not to beat a dead horse, because it's not dead yet, but don't let the new young whippersnapper they have running the machine tell you that you don't need particular measurements "because they're not adjustable" either.
We've heard that story time and time again, at least up until last year, so we know that attitude is still out there.

If their printer is not working, snap a picture of the screen so that you have a permanent record of the settings.

And if you want, while you're on the rack let them set your toe-in to see if it makes a difference.
Likely they'll make the adjustment based on "degrees" rather than "inches" because that's how the listings are showing it these days. In theory the degrees should change based on the tire size, but some here can do the math for you to tell you what your actual toe-in is in fractions-of-an-inch once you let them know the exact radius of your tire.

But the alignment rack is a good starting point for toe-in no matter what size tires.

Good luck.
Glad you're getting it checked. You planning to do some suspension work in the future and getting a reading now? Or just wanting to know what you've got?
Is it stock height now diggs? What month does it say yours was built (using the decal on the driver's door pillar).
Any bets on what this '76 has everybody?

Paul

 

[B RON CO]

Hi, as mentioned, get the castor, camber, and toe #s in writing and save it.
You want to see @ 3* positive castor and 1.5* toe in.
Make sure the tire pressure is set to what you like to run, and don't let them pump up the tires.
Good luck

 

[diggs00]

What Mike said. Get it all if their machine covers it. Including the rear axle measurements too, just to make sure it's not bent.

And not to beat a dead horse, because it's not dead yet, but don't let the new young whippersnapper they have running the machine tell you that you don't need particular measurements "because they're not adjustable" either.
We've heard that story time and time again, at least up until last year, so we know that attitude is still out there.

If their printer is not working, snap a picture of the screen so that you have a permanent record of the settings.

And if you want, while you're on the rack let them set your toe-in to see if it makes a difference.
Likely they'll make the adjustment based on "degrees" rather than "inches" because that's how the listings are showing it these days. In theory the degrees should change based on the tire size, but some here can do the math for you to tell you what your actual toe-in is in fractions-of-an-inch once you let them know the exact radius of your tire.

But the alignment rack is a good starting point for toe-in no matter what size tires.

Good luck.
Glad you're getting it checked. You planning to do some suspension work in the future and getting a reading now? Or just wanting to know what you've got?
Is it stock height now diggs? What month does it say yours was built (using the decal on the driver's door pillar).
Any bets on what this '76 has everybody?

Paul

Paul, thanks for the reply.

Future plan is to put 2.5 lift. It currently is at stock height with a 2inch Body lift. The reason for the alignment is to make sure i order the correct C-bushings and just know my numbers.

I will get VIN month info tonight.

Last photo while driveable:
https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B5VaMsrMLRojWGlYTUxMNzM3TWc
Removed the 12" diameter roll cage! Have a bailie bilt family cage on order.

 

[DirtDonk]

Great looking Bronco!
I haven't seen one of those bars in a long time. I used to like them though (similar to Stropped with the crown in the main hoop) and if I was making a custom it would have a similar crown in the center.
You'll like the Bailie Bilt stuff. Any of it!

Good idea to get the caster.
My guess is that with stock setup, if you have at least a mid-model year build (say, after Jan of '75 or so) you probably have a solid 3.5 degrees of caster. Maybe a little more even.
Possibly even as much as 4.5 degrees of caster already. But I haven't seen too many with that high of a number from the factory. But with yours still being stock, I'm real curious what you find.
What is the current condition of the existing C-bushigns? Are they the original rubber? Or poly?
If rubber, are they in good shape, or pretty nasty and deteriorated?

Sorry for the 20 questions, but it's not often anymore that we get someone who's going to get "before" readings on their rig. And on a later model too. From what we've seen that I remember, the '76 and '77 EB's have been found to have more positive caster initially than the older rigs.

Fun stuff!

Paul

 

[diggs00]

Great looking Bronco!
I haven't seen one of those bars in a long time. I used to like them though (similar to Stropped with the crown in the main hoop) and if I was making a custom it would have a similar crown in the center.
You'll like the Bailie Bilt stuff. Any of it!

Good idea to get the caster.
My guess is that with stock setup, if you have at least a mid-model year build (say, after Jan of '75 or so) you probably have a solid 3.5 degrees of caster. Maybe a little more even.
Possibly even as much as 4.5 degrees of caster already. But I haven't seen too many with that high of a number from the factory. But with yours still being stock, I'm real curious what you find.
What is the current condition of the existing C-bushigns? Are they the original rubber? Or poly?
If rubber, are they in good shape, or pretty nasty and deteriorated?

Sorry for the 20 questions, but it's not often anymore that we get someone who's going to get "before" readings on their rig. And on a later model too. From what we've seen that I remember, the '76 and '77 EB's have been found to have more positive caster initially than the older rigs.

Fun stuff!

Paul

Paul,

No problem, ask away!
Here is an old photo i took a while back, you can get a glimpse of the c bushing. The driver side bushing in particular is chewed up/cracked. You can kinda see it in the image. They look to be poly bushings. They are yellow/orange in color once you etch the black chassis paint they sprayed. This same yellow poly bushing matches the bump stops they put in.

https://drive.google.com/open?id=1kyykzZiERlTARhdeKJwjliveVvZwi90y
https://drive.google.com/open?id=18J_PypaLrs0k59F8mQDOod6Ov2dluxJT

 

[Digger556]

Hi, as mentioned, get the castor, camber, and toe #s in writing and save it.
You want to see @ 3* positive castor and 1.5* toe in.
Make sure the tire pressure is set to what you like to run, and don't let them pump up the tires.
Good luck

That's too much toe.

Factory specs are:

Caster: 3.50°
Camber: 1.50°
Toe: 0.31° ± 0.19°


With tall radial tires and power steering I run:

Caster: 4.5°
Camber: 0.25° (split L to r for road crown)
Toe: 0.25°

This is a more modern alignment setting.


Don't forget to check rear toe, rear camber and thrust angle. (yes rear camber and toe are a thing. They point to bent axle housings)

 

[B RON CO]

Hi, sorry, I made a mistake with the decimal point.
My toe is set at .15* toe in, on each front wheel.
Good luck

 

[OX1]

I bought a used hunter system I use with my 4 post.

I would get everything on both of these screens.
(these are from my 59 T-bird right after full
susp/steering rebuild and before alignment)

Some systems can even measure right height at each corner.

 

[diggs00]

Great looking Bronco!
I haven't seen one of those bars in a long time. I used to like them though (similar to Stropped with the crown in the main hoop) and if I was making a custom it would have a similar crown in the center.
You'll like the Bailie Bilt stuff. Any of it!

Good idea to get the caster.
My guess is that with stock setup, if you have at least a mid-model year build (say, after Jan of '75 or so) you probably have a solid 3.5 degrees of caster. Maybe a little more even.
Possibly even as much as 4.5 degrees of caster already. But I haven't seen too many with that high of a number from the factory. But with yours still being stock, I'm real curious what you find.
What is the current condition of the existing C-bushigns? Are they the original rubber? Or poly?
If rubber, are they in good shape, or pretty nasty and deteriorated?

Sorry for the 20 questions, but it's not often anymore that we get someone who's going to get "before" readings on their rig. And on a later model too. From what we've seen that I remember, the '76 and '77 EB's have been found to have more positive caster initially than the older rigs.

Fun stuff!

Paul

Paul not sure of my build date, i do not have a VIN decoder:
last five digits 35572

and this:
https://drive.google.com/open?id=1vKidjcBSzxAFLQMDt3Ejn5I1KJhHTaW3

 

[DirtDonk]

Here is an old photo i took a while back, you can get a glimpse of the c bushing. The driver side bushing in particular is chewed up/cracked. You can kinda see it in the image. They look to be poly bushings.

Yep, poly for sure. Even without the color confirmation, the original rubber bushings did not have that lip locating them within the radius arms and their caps.
So we'll have to assume to start with then. The minimum offset is 2 degrees, and with a stock suspension that's most likely what they would have installed.
Unless there had been a lift kit on it at one time, then replaced by stock stuff before selling. In which case they could be anything.

So once you determine what your caster is, you will still have to see what the bushings are if you really want to make a change.

I do not have a VIN decoder: last five digits 35572

What is the letter just before the digits? Lots of members here have the decoding information for most years, so likely with that letter they can tell you just about when it was built.
And I know it's not the normal practice elsewhere, but around here we've been posting our full VIN's for a long time. Not sure what nefarious deeds can be done with the knowledge, but I totally understand being careful.

The first characters are likely U15 since you have a '76 and there were no more roadsters or, as far as I know, pickups either. So no U13's or U14's in '76, just U15 (Wagon body style with full hard top).
Then would have been GL for 302 V8 (were I-6's still available in '76?) and the Michigan Truck Plant assembly line.
So the only other letter would indicate the running numbers and yours is probably in the V or X category unless they didn't use X. Pretty sure all the Y's and Z's and then the 0's were for '77 models.
With the warranty plate you have on your glovebox door, others can determine what were some of the main options.

But for the full Monte of information, you go to Martiauto.com and get a Marti Report. You can pay as little as 40 bucks I think, or up to 300 or so for the full framed presentation version. Which one you want usually depends on how attached you are to the Bronco!
But that report will literally include the window sticker information, showing all of your optional equipment.
Check out the "Show Us Your Marti Report" thread hereabouts.

Cool stuff. Finally got mine now that they're expensive. Many years ago I think they were $15 bucks or something like that.

Paul

 

[diggs00]

Yep, poly for sure. Even without the color confirmation, the original rubber bushings did not have that lip locating them within the radius arms and their caps.
So we'll have to assume to start with then. The minimum offset is 2 degrees, and with a stock suspension that's most likely what they would have installed.
Unless there had been a lift kit on it at one time, then replaced by stock stuff before selling. In which case they could be anything.

So once you determine what your caster is, you will still have to see what the bushings are if you really want to make a change.



What is the letter just before the digits? Lots of members here have the decoding information for most years, so likely with that letter they can tell you just about when it was built.
And I know it's not the normal practice elsewhere, but around here we've been posting our full VIN's for a long time. Not sure what nefarious deeds can be done with the knowledge, but I totally understand being careful.

The first characters are likely U15 since you have a '76 and there were no more roadsters or, as far as I know, pickups either. So no U13's or U14's in '76, just U15 (Wagon body style with full hard top).
Then would have been GL for 302 V8 (were I-6's still available in '76?) and the Michigan Truck Plant assembly line.
So the only other letter would indicate the running numbers and yours is probably in the V or X category unless they didn't use X. Pretty sure all the Y's and Z's and then the 0's were for '77 models.
With the warranty plate you have on your glovebox door, others can determine what were some of the main options.

But for the full Monte of information, you go to Martiauto.com and get a Marti Report. You can pay as little as 40 bucks I think, or up to 300 or so for the full framed presentation version. Which one you want usually depends on how attached you are to the Bronco!
But that report will literally include the window sticker information, showing all of your optional equipment.
Check out the "Show Us Your Marti Report" thread hereabouts.

Cool stuff. Finally got mine now that they're expensive. Many years ago I think they were $15 bucks or something like that.

Paul

Paul here is the full vin.
u15GLB35572

 

[Justafordguy]

Hey Diggs,
I noticed that in the picture of your passenger side C bushings it looks like the top two bolts of the radius arm cap are missing. You better check that out ASAP if you haven't already.

 

[diggs00]

Hey Diggs,
I noticed that in the picture of your passenger side C bushings it looks like the top two bolts of the radius arm cap are missing. You better check that out ASAP if you haven't already.

Thank Justafordguy, yes i just picked up a whole new set of grade 8 bolts yesterday. Gonna throw them in the missing holes before I go to the shop.

Weird thing is I drove from Dallas to Austin when i picked the bronco up. who knows how many bolts i had intact then. scary.

 

[DirtDonk]

A "B" eh? Did not expect that!
I know the letters turned over, but I thought it was only in '77. Show's how much I know about VIN's and that's why we have experts here.:-[

Paul

 

[sprdv1]

Driving to alignment shop in near future.

#1 goal is to find my current caster angle. Is there anything else they might not capture that I need to know?

1976 Bronco

Find a shop used by Friend, that is Trusted.

 

[sprdv1]

Great looking Bronco!

yes it is for sure....

 

[sprdv1]

Paul,

They look to be poly bushings.

agree with pual on that one...

 

[sprdv1]

A "B" eh? Did not expect that!
I know the letters turned over, but I thought it was only in '77. Show's how much I know about VIN's and that's why we have experts here.:-[

No doubt brother.. lol