New / Old broncos being made from new parts.

[MD]

So does it mean you have a mismatch between your title (original title) and your Bronco (new CHP assigned VIN)? Thanks

No, the CHP VIN matches the frame, the door sticker, the glove box and the title. CA just wanted to add their own, because well they supercede all.

 

[bax]

I guess I am still missing something here. If I can't do the frame / body / title switcharoo. Then why is it ok for these builders that are doing that exact scenario? It must be legal. I mean if you had a bronco in your name , legally titled to you, and wanted to swap out the frame for one of those fancy ones. Then decided a new body would be easier than fixing the rust. So you purchase a new body. Get it all fixed up nice and bolt your glove box door onto your finished project. Take it for a ride and at the gas station some one offered you 200K for it. Are you telling me you can't sell it because that would be illegal?

 

[Slowleak]

The glove box plate is simply a warranty plate. The frame is the registered and titled part. It is the legal “vehicle” and if inspected when getting a tag or title, the DMV is supposed to check the frame to verify the VIN#. If they do not find one on a Bronco, they can impound the vehicle. At a minimum, what you are describing could cause a lot of grief and legal issues. If you do it, my advice would be to provide the old frame to the buyer as part of the deal and make sure it is all in writing. You can swap a body without a problem because bodies are not titled.
My understanding is that a new frame would come with a Manufacturers Statement of Origin. You would take that, and your paperwork to the DMV and they would assign a new VIN to the vehicle. The Bronco would be titled under that new VIN.
If you are a licensed builder, in some states there are ways where if a frame and matching title exist, and are inspected by the DMV, they will allow the VIN to be kept and used with a new frame provided the old frame is destroyed. I know that process exists in cases where vintage vehicles are restored and the restoration requires that the frame be replaced. Florida DMV may allow this as well.

I expect it is in here somewhere. I see the word “felony” used a lot….

Statutes & Constitution :View Statutes : Online Sunshine

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[bax]

The glove box plate is simply a warranty plate. The frame is the registered and titled part. It is the legal “vehicle” and if inspected when getting a tag or title, the DMV is supposed to check the frame to verify the VIN#. If they do not find one on a Bronco, they can impound the vehicle. At a minimum, what you are describing could cause a lot of grief and legal issues. If you do it, my advice would be to provide the old frame to the buyer as part of the deal and make sure it is all in writing. You can swap a body without a problem because bodies are not titled.
My understanding is that a new frame would come with a Manufacturers Statement of Origin. You would take that, and your paperwork to the DMV and they would assign a new VIN to the vehicle. The Bronco would be titled under that new VIN.
If you are a licensed builder, in some states there are ways where if a frame and matching title exist, and are inspected by the DMV, they will allow the VIN to be kept and used with a new frame provided the old frame is destroyed. I know that process exists in cases where vintage vehicles are restored and the restoration requires that the frame be replaced. Florida DMV may allow this as well.

I expect it is in here somewhere. I see the word “felony” used a lot….

http://[URL]http://www.leg.state.fl...=Display_Statute&URL=0300-0399/0319/0319.html

[/URL]


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I understand what you are saying. But it makes no sense that what you say should not be done, is being done. Not even trying to hide it. I want a new / old bronco. I plunk down 200 K to one of the many builders, what do I get? I get a new body , a new frame, updated or replaced everything else. How is it titled??? What is it's vin number? U14FL795861 ????
You are telling me thats not right! I tend to agree. I am being told its against the law, but it's being done everyday right out in public for all to see. Even so far as to advertise all the upgrades, frame , motor, body, electronics, etc. But advertised and sold as an original bronco.

 

[marin77]

No, the CHP VIN matches the frame, the door sticker, the glove box and the title. CA just wanted to add their own, because well they supercede all.

Thanks for clarifying - much appreciated.

 

[Slowleak]

I understand what you are saying. But it makes no sense that what you say should not be done, is being done. Not even trying to hide it. I want a new / old bronco. I plunk down 200 K to one of the many builders, what do I get? I get a new body , a new frame, updated or replaced everything else. How is it titled??? What is it's vin number? U14FL795861 ????
You are telling me thats not right! I tend to agree. I am being told its against the law, but it's being done everyday right out in public for all to see. Even so far as to advertise all the upgrades, frame , motor, body, electronics, etc. But advertised and sold as an original bronco.

Yep. I agree it’s not right. The only thing I can figure is that some states allow exceptions for licensed builders, such as ICON, who replace frames. I expect there is a process of inspection and proof of destruction of the old frame which allows the vin to be reused along with a state inspection tag. I’ve never had the chance to inspect an ICON for tags.
A “68” ICON was listed on Barrett-Jackson. VIN# U15NLD14446 with this disclaimer “**VIN NOTICE: DEPENDING ON THE STATE OF REGISTRATION OF THE BUYER, THE VEHICLE MAY REQUIRE AN INSPECTION AND BE SUBJECT TO A STATE-ISSUED VIN AND/OR OTHER REQUIREMENTS OF THAT STATE.**”

 

[bax]

Yep. I agree it’s not right. The only thing I can figure is that some states allow exceptions for licensed builders, such as ICON, who replace frames. I expect there is a process of inspection and proof of destruction of the old frame which allows the vin to be reused along with a state inspection tag. I’ve never had the chance to inspect an ICON for tags.
A “68” ICON was listed on Barrett-Jackson. VIN# U15NLD14446 with this disclaimer “**VIN NOTICE: DEPENDING ON THE STATE OF REGISTRATION OF THE BUYER, THE VEHICLE MAY REQUIRE AN INSPECTION AND BE SUBJECT TO A STATE-ISSUED VIN AND/OR OTHER REQUIREMENTS OF THAT STATE.**”

Well thats like saying buyer beware. We F'ed with our bronco and if you buy it, you may not be able to register it your state. Well at least they're honest??? On the other hand if it had a state issued vin. Is it no longer a "real" bronco? I sure hope so.

 

[Slowleak]

Well thats like saying buyer beware. We F'ed with our bronco and if you buy it, you may not be able to register it your state. Well at least they're honest??? On the other hand if it had a state issued vin. Is it no longer a "real" bronco? I sure hope so.

Exactly. I take it to mean “You are ok in California, we paid off the DMV with some of your money”.

 

[Revelation]

Well thats like saying buyer beware. We F'ed with our bronco and if you buy it, you may not be able to register it your state. Well at least they're honest??? On the other hand if it had a state issued vin. Is it no longer a "real" bronco? I sure hope so.

How do people legally replace a rotted frame on a Bronco?

 

[bax]

Hey Rev. Yeah we have been talking about it. I am still not sure how they do it legal like.

 

[Jmjuhl]

I looked into replacing my frame long and hard more from a cost perspective as mine needed some work...hours spent on old frame vs plug and play. After speaking with one of the frame manufacturers they pointed me to the SEMA 50 states web page and suggested I research state specific guidelines...I got the vibe of "you do your own research, we will supply all the documentation, titling is on you". The process as it was explained was to start with a titled, registered, and plated Bronco in your name and go to DMV, show them title, all documentation of the frame swap, new frame manufacturer ID number, and they amend your existing title to keep current 66-77 VIN but designate it somehow to show new frame. Effectively a frame swap.

If not done this way, or trying to do it after the fact you can end up with a State designated VIN number, or worst case titled as an "assembled vehicle" and vehicle year would be the year in which the frame was manufactured...this makes it subject to emissions/safety requirements for that year and can cause all kinds of issues.

Since mine was not running and on an out of state title, I opted to cancel the new frame idea and get mine right. The last thing I wanted to do was put all the money into the build and then run into titling, registration issues, or an assigned VIN. If I was buying a Bronco that had a new frame I would do a bunch of research on the title before purchase...if not designated on the title, then what do you actually have a title to?

I ended up powder coating my frame and made sure they taped off the two legible VIN numbers...and then I clear coated over those...sure makes it easier and cleaner when everything matches.

 

[ngsd]

good choice

 

[chuck1022]

Here is my idea:

1-Buy a Krawlers Edge frame
2-Buy an old bronco for the frame and title.
3-weld in vin to appropriate location on new frame
4-Probably have to get a lawyer cause DMV thinks i am a chop shop
5-Get divorce lawyer cause my wife leaves me
6-Liquidate all assets for wife and gov't
7-Get face/neck and hand tattoos as I am a criminal

 

[sprdv1]

Well thats like saying buyer beware. We F'ed with our bronco and if you buy it, you may not be able to register it your state. Well at least they're honest??? On the other hand if it had a state issued vin. Is it no longer a "real" bronco? I sure hope so.

right..

 

[Rustytruck]

for a long time collectors were transferring difficult cars to a title service in Maine. Maine would transfer a car with a bill of sale to a new owner resident in Maine and issue Maine title then the service would sell you your car back with a bill of sale and new title. you walked into dmv to transfer your new titled vehicle to you. I don't know the details with frame numbers or state frame stickers. but that was being done for a good ten years. The clerk at California DMV gets honked up because our early vin numbers are too short to be a vin number in their computer wont accept a short number so old cars have to be handled differently. funny thing i can get it done with AAA they don't get honked up with the short number. it been a while since I have been dealing with DMV here since they shut down with the covid scam and tried to transfer operations to on line computer. I use to travel out of LA to Barstow to do my DMV work as they were less busy and all of their employees spoke English and very experienced. They knew how to get things done and if they needed guidance they knew who to call in Sacramento all difficult decisions go to Sacramento..

 

[flexmerc]

From my personal experience, in NC around 2014:
In GA you don’t need a title to sell/buy a vehicle, just registration and bill of sale.
some states, as NC req a title stamped by a notary and signed by both party’s… buyer and seller.
when I registered my GA bronco in NC I had to have the DMV inspect the vins glove box/frame, take pictures and check their data base to ensure it wasn’t stolen.
The whole check was to ensure it wasn’t stolen and protect me the buyer, so it seemed… then I was issued a new title with the OG vin After the thorough check, this took months.

 

[Slowleak]

From my personal experience, in NC around 2014:
In GA you don’t need a title to sell/buy a vehicle, just registration and bill of sale.
some states, as NC req a title stamped by a notary and signed by both party’s… buyer and seller.
when I registered my GA bronco in NC I had to have the DMV inspect the vins glove box/frame, take pictures and check their data base to ensure it wasn’t stolen.
The whole check was to ensure it wasn’t stolen and protect me the buyer, so it seemed… then I was issued a new title with the OG vin After the thorough check, this took months.

The problem in Georgia is that 1963-1985 vehicles can be registered/tagged using a either title or a bill of sale. However, they will not issue a title for one if it has ever been registered in the state using a bill of sale.
So, if you sell a vehicle with a title, and the buyer registers it in Georgia without getting a title in his name, it can NEVER be titled in Georgia again. If you bring your Bronco back to Georgia, or sell it in Georgia, it cannot be titled even though you have a NC title. If it was older than ‘63 you could get a “conditional title”, if newer than ‘85 you would have to get a title….. it’s messed up….

 

[Madgyver]

how much of the original frame has to be intact to be legally registered original with VIN?
I'm sure it differs in your state but is it in your state if you know the answer/s.

 

[bax]

how much of the original frame has to be intact to be legally registered original with VIN?
I'm sure it differs in your state but is it in your state if you know the answer/s.

Well Mad, there are bronco builder companies doing it with zero pieces of the original frame. I would bet that they are leaving the tilting and registration up to the new buyer. Fromm what I get for this thread is that some have zero issues, others have to jump thru many hoops. Some even get new titles and vins created. It's a shit show in my opinion.

 

[bax]

Here is the thing that keeps coming back to me. Some say that Florida is easy to get cars registered. My second bronco that I built from out of state. I had the signed title, I had the bill of sale, I had the vin tag. When I tried to register it they refused until the sheriff office inspected the vehicle. OK. Made an appointment for this to happen. The officer looked the truck over said he could not confirm the vin on the frame. No shit, it had por 15 and 2 coats of urethane paint on it. I had to get under the truck and scrape the paint off the frame. The only way you could see it is from the top or from the inside of the wheel well with the wheel turned all the way to the drivers side. Thank goodness for the 3'' body lift. The headers did not help much. Well with a mirror and a flashlight he was able to confirm the vin on the frame. I was then able to get the truck registered. Now my third bronco I purchased it local. Did about the same amount of work. Had the same information. It got registered no questions asked. Didn't even ask me what color it was. Walked in , walked out. Done. So lets say this, I dont know if this is how it would work. If I purchased a bronco replica from a Florida based builder. I would ask for a titled in florida truck. After the truck was done and purchased. I would the just go register it and go on. No questions asked, cool. But what if the sheriff had to inspect it? Back to buyer beware again.