Rebuild my 302 or buy a turnkey/Crate motor

[tribaltalon]

Well, if you've been following my build in the chat side, you'll know I've got a 1971 EB that i'm doing a 1 ton conversion on, and recently pulled the drivetrain to replace gaskets and install a NP435. Last night I started pulling the water pump, and proceeded to break off 4 bolts in the water pump. i then noticed the timing cover was cracked. I may or may not have gotten mad and started beating the motor up with a sledgehammer. Needless to say the water pump is now off, and it appears that it was the original water pump from 1971, and there is a ton of corrosion damage to the timing cover. I'm at the very least going to have to replace the timing cover and somehow get the broken studs out of the block, and at which point I almost might as well rebuild the whole motor. If the water pump was never replaced, its a safe bet that pretty much everything else is original too, right? I never did a compression check (which I should have). What do you guys think? Should I just get this motor rebuilt by somebody, or go on summitracing or similiar and buy a turnkey motor for a couple of grand? Either way I go, I'll be slapping a 400hp FiTech on it.

 

[daddycreswell]

I've been going back and forth on this as well, still haven't decided because I don't think I really need to rebuild my engine yet. Anyway, I was talking to a mechanic friend of mine the other day and asked him what was the best route to go. He said buy another engine, he told me it would cost about the same if you aren't doing anything else special to the new engine. Plus it comes with a longer warranty than a rebuilt one. They use Grooms engines, I think he told me it had a 3yr/36,000 mile warranty on it. So if and when I do it, that the route I'm going to go.

 

[tribaltalon]

Thats exactly what I'm thinking. I kind of feel like if I buy a turnkey motor, that it will increase the value of my bronco exponentially over having the existing motor rebuilt. (as well as the warranty)

 

[Timmy390]

I would not mess with an old 71 block unless it's something special and or has sentimental value to you. I got an old one I just removed on my engine stand and I guess I'll haul it off for scrap. The newer block have one piece rear main seals and are rollers.

You're going to drop $2700 min on a turnkeyish crate at Summit. You can get a short block for $1500

I would source a block local from the yard or a running Explorer and have it rebuilt. My rebuild of a running 96 351W was about 1K in machine shop work and engine kit. I built it stock punching it .020 over. Did the disassembly and assembly myself.

Sourcing a local block will get you the front dress as well so upgraded alt, PS pump, Serp belt and fan.

Tim

 

[Timmy390]

Most places will not warranty the engines unless installed by someone certified by them to do so. Say you go with a Jasper engine and the shop you're working with isn't certified with Jasper, no warranty through Jasper.

Tim

 

[EB70]

I have a good running engine in my 70, but it does have some blowby etc. Doesn't smoke etc. But with the blowby and leaks I intend to go through it.

My method is to get a roller engine. I'd get a newer one and install it. Just better in every way. Unless yours is a restoration then the numbers may matter.

 

[tribaltalon]

no sentimental value at all. Purely value based is all I care about. I've thought about buying a junkyard motor, but then I could end up wasting money if I buy the wrong motor. I've already got a HUGE amount of work to do on the suspension and everything else, I do NOT want to add rebuilding an engine to that. So I'd either be getting a motor rebuilt and ready to drop in, or buying a crate motor and dropping it in.

 

[Timmy390]

It's never as simple as just dropping it in.....just my experience.

Tim

 

[tribaltalon]

I understand that. That's why I'm trying to figure out which way I need to go to make it as simple as possible. Hell I went on autozone and priced out a surefire 302 replacement. the long block is around 1700 bucks. From the research I've done, a roller motor wont be a direct swap because then the accessory drive wont work right. I've already got a full hydro pump thats set for V drive, and I'm really not wanting to redo any of that.

 

[BOBS 2 68S]

For me I rebuild. I enjoy building motors, both Broncos and the 71 Vette have my built motors. Only problem was a timing chain failure ( 20-50 oil and -28 deg chain went). And then I know what I have and what will fit.

 

[JAFO]

I was going to rebuild, because I like rebuilding motors. But in the end I bought a rebuilt 302 block from Advance Auto (had the heads installed) so I could just get the truck on the road quicker. Bought an Edelbrock intake, Holley carb and such and built it up. The engine runs fantastic, no oil leaking and reliable. Seemed like the easiest route to take. But for me I was so ready to be driving the truck I didn't want to rebuild anything else. Had already rebuilt the trans, the rears, etc. Seven years ago the block (with heads) was $1200. Due to circumstances it sit on an engine stand seven years, but that didn't seem to hurt it. It had oil in the pan and I turned it over by hand every once in a while.

 

[tirewater]

But for me I was so ready to be driving the truck....it sit on an engine stand seven years

Wait a second...

 

[tribaltalon]

Well, I've been searching and I found a 1996 Explorer 5.0 2wd Auto for very cheap. It's got 150k miles but the owner said it runs and drives great. I'm thinking about pulling the motor, and scrapping the rest. At that point I could either try and get a RJM harness oooorrr..... Pull the entire EFI kit off, install my carb intake and a FiTech for super simplicity...

 

[Timmy390]

Well, I've been searching and I found a 1996 Explorer 5.0 2wd Auto for very cheap. It's got 150k miles but the owner said it runs and drives great. I'm thinking about pulling the motor, and scrapping the rest. At that point I could either try and get a RJM harness oooorrr..... Pull the entire EFI kit off, install my carb intake and a FiTech for super simplicity...

Now you're thinking.......

That was my play then I found 351W so I went with that. Running driving E350 for $800 The engine had unknown miles on it and the van had sat for 3 years but it ran and drive. The engine had between 8 an 9 thousands wear in the bores. I pulled all the EFI stuff off and parted out the van. I then scrapped the rest. I ended up $65 in the hole. I reused the front dress off the van too.

Tim

 

[WARDOG]

I went through the similar quandary last summer.
The 302 that was freshly 'rebuilt' from the PO was a wheezer. The PO gave me all receipts, but he obviously had no idea what he was doing (for the rest of the rig for that matter). It was overheating on medium inclines, short on power, etc.

I struggled with the financial decision to have it rebuilt, but it had already been bored over .030". I decided for the same $ I could rebuild a 351W. I started shopping for a virgin 351 block but couldn't find one. I had the right people to assist me in rebuilding one, but I priced it all out, & I wanted a warranty.

I ended up getting a motor, turnkey, from Blueprint Engines / Marshall Engines. They are sold by Summit, but I ordered direct. I did a load of research on every affordable crate engine company. There are horror stories on every one, including Ford. SO far I have nothing but good to say about BluePrint.

You can get an iron head engine pretty inexpensive considering what you'll pay to build one from scratch. You also get a warranty 3yr/30k miles.
I went overboard and got the 408 stroker, aluminum heads. It is an animal and overkill for the Bronco. But I like overkill, just hate the fuel mileage.
I now have 900 miles on it. The first 400 miles were mostly off-road easy miles while hunting in the mountains. The last 500 miles I have been pretty hard on it. A friend has their 347 in his Bronco and it is just about as good, better mileage, same HP just not the torque of the 408.
ANother thing that sold me on TurnKey is the motor was tested on the Dyno for 30 minutes before shipment. It is so easy to get the wrong parts when building an engine, and if you have to install them to figure out what parts are wrong it can be ultra frustrating.
When I installed it in my rig, it started on the second revolution. That there was worth some extra $.

 

[tribaltalon]

Very good input. Thanks WarDog. I know for sure I dont want another 351w, my last one was a pretty stout 357w and to be honest I never needed all that power. If anything it made it harder to drive at low rpm's which is what I usually am at with my crawlers. I looked at the Blueprints but thats more money (and HP) then I have and need. Glad to hear it's worked out well for you!