New gear reduction starter install

[Steve83]

installing a mean green starter, and it has a small jumper wire on the starter. Do I now get rid of the smaller gauge wire that hooks to the right side of the solenoid, or ???

(click this text)

 

[DirtDonk]

Hey Steve. I’ve been having trouble loading your pages for months. Last time I tried, it went OK, but before that, just as now, when I click on your links, nothing happens. It sits there thinking about it, but doesn’t fully load.
Is that an ongoing problem with super motors? Or is it a browser or device thing?

 

[DirtDonk]

And speaking of not loading Jon… Were your pictures PhotoBucket jobs?
Any chance you can reload some of the images, or is this yet another device issue perhaps trying to view it through my phone?
Thanks

 

[Steve83]

Hey Steve. I’ve been having trouble loading your pages for months.

It took a month or so for the website's security certificate to be renewed for 2024, and there have been a few brief maintenance outages since then, but its pages are loading faster than ever for me. What browser/device/connection are you using? Try a different one. I only surf the forums on a Win10Prox64 desktop through a cable modem at my house.

 

[DirtDonk]

Yeah, using a good connection here, with AT&T fiber and Windows 10 pro-64 at home also. Using Safari on the phone, but Firefox or AOL on the desktop.
This last time, all three had the same loading issue. Actually, this time I never could wait around long enough for the pages to load.
I'll try again right now...

Paul

 

[DirtDonk]

Well that was not quite as bad.
AOL loaded in about 30 seconds, Firefox took about 3 minutes, but Safari on the phone is still trying as I type. Ooops, there it is! So about five minutes on the phone.

Thanks. Now I can try to get edumacated some more...

Paul

 

[DirtDonk]

installing a mean green starter, and it has a small jumper wire on the starter. Do I now get rid of the smaller gauge wire that hooks to the right side of the solenoid, or ???

Did you get this figured out yet Bruiser? Did you try calling Mean Green?
If I remember, they're using a design completely different from a PMGR starter. Even though it's smaller, and may have it's own internal solenoid, I think there is only the one connection point on them? Correct?
If so, should be for the main starter cable. Which means that, yes, you need to remove the smaller gauge wire.
But if not, and there is a second point of connection, then it's probably for the smaller wire. So whatcha got?

Got a pic of this offending beast? Does it have just one, or multiple points of connection.
Guess I could search out MG instructions, but it's more fun to just ask here!

Anyway, hope you got it figured out.

 

[DirtDonk]

Nevermind. Just saw that they're using a different design from the ones I remember. I'll have to do a little more digging on their site.
Don't see any links to any instructions, so hopefully it came with some in your box?

Looks to me though, as if they want you to connect the large starter cable to it, directly to the battery (or in our case, to the starter relay on the fender) and then a smaller one to the a visible connector with black insulator adjacent to the big stud.
Does that sound about right?

If so, then leave your setup as-is, with the battery cable AND the starter cable attached to the left side of the starter relay, then run the starter cable down to the large lug/stud on the starter. Then, your smaller wire from the right side of the relay to the small connector of the starter body.

Test this carefully however, as I'm not standing there with you and can't be sure. You're theoretically doing this with the battery disconnected, so once you have the starter cable connected you can quickly touch the battery cables back to the battery to make sure that the starter is not going to energize, engage and spin. If not, continue to connect the battery and test the system.
But generally speaking, no matter what type of starter you use, leave the factory starter relay in place and use it as a central connection point for the wires/cables, and to take all the loads off of the ignition switch.

Paul

 

[BruiserOutdoors]

Nevermind. Just saw that they're using a different design from the ones I remember. I'll have to do a little more digging on their site.
Don't see any links to any instructions, so hopefully it came with some in your box?

Looks to me though, as if they want you to connect the large starter cable to it, directly to the battery (or in our case, to the starter relay on the fender) and then a smaller one to the a visible connector with black insulator adjacent to the big stud.
Does that sound about right?

If so, then leave your setup as-is, with the battery cable AND the starter cable attached to the left side of the starter relay, then run the starter cable down to the large lug/stud on the starter. Then, your smaller wire from the right side of the relay to the small connector of the starter body.

Test this carefully however, as I'm not standing there with you and can't be sure. You're theoretically doing this with the battery disconnected, so once you have the starter cable connected you can quickly touch the battery cables back to the battery to make sure that the starter is not going to energize, engage and spin. If not, continue to connect the battery and test the system.
But generally speaking, no matter what type of starter you use, leave the factory starter relay in place and use it as a central connection point for the wires/cables, and to take all the loads off of the ignition switch.

Paul

I bought it from WH several years ago, and per usual, just getting around to installing it. It only has one connection one as I recall so perhaps has its own solenoid? Wiring is my least favorite thing and I have very little experience and understanding of electrical to be completely honest!

it looks like WH no longer sells this (I wonder why?)

 

[MarsChariot]

Problems still!

Thought I would bring this back up. I just got a new remanufactured gear reduction starter this Friday. I took the old one off and the top bolt was a little hard to get too but got it off finally. I installed the new starter and hooked up the wires to the solenoid as I have read on here. Went to crank it up and it turned over fast but it has a weird sound when doing so. Almost like the teeth are not meshing together like they should. I got the right one and it is an automatic which mine is. It still starts I just want to make sure the sound that I am hearing is normal or should it be fixed somehow? Also, since replacing the starter, I still have the "Not wanting to turn over after driven for some time" Problem. I drove it to some places yesterday and the second place I stopped I just about did not get it started. It took awhile. IT just kept turning over and not firing. I did finally manage to get it started and get home but I am a little reluctant to drive it right now till I try and get this solved. I thought the original problem was because of the old ford starter getting heat soak was the problem and going with a new gear reduction starter would solve the problem but I think I still have it. Any suggestions on what to do next?

First thing is to make absolutely certain that you have a good ground wire/strap/cable from the block to the negative battery post. I had a slow crank problem suddenly with my GR starter and it took me months to figure out that my ground was not as secure as I thought. MOved it to another absolutely secure location and the problem was immediately solved.

 

[DirtDonk]

I bought it from WH several years ago, and per usual, just getting around to installing it.

Boy, do I know how that scenario goes!
Story of my life…

It only has one connection one as I recall so perhaps has its own solenoid?

It’s possible. Or it’s possible that it doesn’t use a solenoid. Can you post a picture of your individual unit?
The current models appear to definitely have a solenoid.

it looks like WH no longer sells this (I wonder why?)

Well, I’m not really aware of any particular problems associated with it, or the high output alternators. But at the higher than normal pricing, as Mean Green products generally are, we may just not have sold enough to make it worth it.
Perhaps there were larger minimum orders that the company implemented or something else.
Another common scenario is a company taking too long to deliver product.
I haven’t heard that about Mean Green in particular, so I can’t really comment. But we’ve run into that often enough with other companies that I mentioned it.

 

[BruiserOutdoors]

Boy, do I know how that scenario goes!
Story of my life…

It’s possible. Or it’s possible that it doesn’t use a solenoid. Can you post a picture of your individual unit?
The current models appear to definitely have a solenoid.

Well, I’m not really aware of any particular problems associated with it, or the high output alternators. But at the higher than normal pricing, as Mean Green products generally are, we may just not have sold enough to make it worth it.
Perhaps there were larger minimum orders that the company implemented or something else.
Another common scenario is a company taking too long to deliver product.
I haven’t heard that about Mean Green in particular, so I can’t really comment. But we’ve run into that often enough with other companies that I mentioned it.

Closest I could find online.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/1155906104...d=link&campid=5335857059&toolid=20001&mkevt=1

 

[DirtDonk]

You might loo

It only has one connection one as I recall so perhaps has its own solenoid?

If that pic is close to yours, then I would revisit yours and have a deeper look-see to find that second connection.
See in the pic that plastic isolator with the "S" stenciled next to it? That would be the "switch" connector and it would be wired as I mentioned before.

1. Starter cable from battery side of fender mounted starter relay to the large stud on the starter.
2. Smaller wire from the starter side of the fender mounted relay down to the "S" connector.

If yours does not look like the one pictured exactly though, you will need to take a pic yourself and post it up for us to see. Or send it to me and I can post it up.

Paul

 

[BruiserOutdoors]

You might loo

If that pic is close to yours, then I would revisit yours and have a deeper look-see to find that second connection.
See in the pic that plastic isolator with the "S" stenciled next to it? That would be the "switch" connector and it would be wired as I mentioned before.

1. Starter cable from battery side of fender mounted starter relay to the large stud on the starter.
2. Smaller wire from the starter side of the fender mounted relay down to the "S" connector.

If yours does not look like the one pictured exactly though, you will need to take a pic yourself and post it up for us to see. Or send it to me and I can post it up.

Paul

Mine came with a green wire that connects the main terminal to the switch. Theres no place for a smaller wire to connect. Similar to this, where the wire connects to the large terminal on the starter.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/1664752633...d=link&campid=5335857059&toolid=20001&mkevt=1

 

[DirtDonk]

Mine came with a green wire that connects the main terminal to the switch.

That is not the main terminal. It is isolated from the main terminal by the plastic insulator.
It is to be considered a separate entity.
Therefore, two separate connections. One big, one small.
One (large) to carry the current needed by the starter from the battery, and one (small) to switch the starter on.

The green wire is a small wire and could not possibly carry the current of the starter. For that you must connect a large gauge cable to the large stud using the supplied large nut.
This cable should be at least 6 gauge, or preferably 4. Better still, would be 2.

Theres no place for a smaller wire to connect. Similar to this, where the wire connects to the large terminal on the starter.

The small wire is already connected. In that picture, the green wire is slipped over a small blade connector within that plastic insulator.
The plastic insulator in this case, is simply surrounding and protecting a second connector.
That is the place for the smaller wire, and that smaller wire must be connected to the right hand starter-side of your fender mounted starter relay.
This is what sends the signal from the key in START, first to the starter relay, then down to the starter solenoid, to engage the starter.

So, if I remember your description correctly, you need to take your existing starter cable, currently still connected to the battery side of the starter relay, I believe, and connect the other end to that large stud on your starter.
Then connect the green wire to the other side of the starter relay. If it’s not long enough, extend it or replace it with one that is.

If you can post up a picture of your engine compartment in that area, showing the starter relay, this would help.

 

[DirtDonk]

Mine came with a green wire that connects the main terminal to the switch.

If, by this, you mean the green wire connected directly to your ignition switch, then, no.
On our trucks, we do not connect a starter solenoid directly to the ignition switch. We continue to use the original fender mounted relay to not only isolate any back-feeding to keep the starter from running on, but primarily to take any extra load of a solenoid off of the ignition switch.
Whether it’s a design parameter or not, we have found that people that connect their starters directly to the ignition switch, often have premature failures of the ignition switch.

Keep the fender mounted relay.

 

[BruiserOutdoors]

That is not the main terminal. It is isolated from the main terminal by the plastic insulator.
It is to be considered a separate entity.
Therefore, two separate connections. One big, one small.
One (large) to carry the current needed by the starter from the battery, and one (small) to switch the starter on.

The green wire is a small wire and could not possibly carry the current of the starter. For that you must connect a large gauge cable to the large stud using the supplied large nut.
This cable should be at least 6 gauge, or preferably 4. Better still, would be 2.

The small wire is already connected. In that picture, the green wire is slipped over a small blade connector within that plastic insulator.
The plastic insulator in this case, is simply surrounding and protecting a second connector.
That is the place for the smaller wire, and that smaller wire must be connected to the right hand starter-side of your fender mounted starter relay.
This is what sends the signal from the key in START, first to the starter relay, then down to the starter solenoid, to engage the starter.

So, if I remember your description correctly, you need to take your existing starter cable, currently still connected to the battery side of the starter relay, I believe, and connect the other end to that large stud on your starter.
Then connect the green wire to the other side of the starter relay. If it’s not long enough, extend it or replace it with one that is.

If you can post up a picture of your engine compartment in that area, showing the starter relay, this would help.

I will try to take some photos tonight, I have hesitated because I haven't paid my CB dues. Stay tuned.

 

[DirtDonk]

I should be able to receive them at my wildhorses e-mail address again. If you don't want to re-up just yet (but it's always a good idea!) you can send some to me at paulb@wildhorses4x4.com and I should be able to post them up for others to see as well.

Thanks

Paul

 

[BruiserOutdoors]

I should be able to receive them at my wildhorses e-mail address again. If you don't want to re-up just yet (but it's always a good idea!) you can send some to me at paulb@wildhorses4x4.com and I should be able to post them up for others to see as well.

Thanks

Paul

Try this link, if it doesnt work I will email you.

https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fo/y9b73wy401cipvpikkg0a/h?rlkey=5d4h9wsnxdnwi3s9unmz7j0tg&dl=0

 

[DirtDonk]

Got 'em, thanks. Good pics. I'll post one or two of them up here for others to see. If it lets me download them from Dropbox that is.
But knowing only what I know, I don't see any possible purpose for the green wire to be connected to both the main power stud (constant 12v power) AND the smaller, apparently control connection.
It's Friday, so if you have not already, I would call Mean Green right now and find out what they have to say. If not, you'll miss out on two more days before you can ask them again.

Have you tried connecting the battery to power at this point? If not, I would at least touch the cables to the battery and find out if the starter cranks immediately upon connecting the battery.
Obviously, it should not. But if not, then why not?

Paul