AOD Remote Only Trans Cooler setups

[nvrstuk]

I was wondering the same. I have a problem even getting close to 190deg operating in my 6r so I've never even wired in my converter lock function that I ran with my 4r70w.

2 days ago in 85deg temps we were chugging in 2nd & 3rd for 3 hrs (a few stops) climbing to 5K ft on very rough, rocky trails & my 2 trans temp gauges both read 140deg at it's peak.

 

[ntsqd]

The lack of a lock-up hurts, but the high stall is the real heat generator. Does the engine have that much cam in it?

 

[ba123]

Nothing crazy…e303.

When I first finished the build I did have a temp sensor in the cooling out port and the temps hit like 280° after a 20-30 minute drive.

It’s weird that it gets this hot imo and don’t understand.

 

[ntsqd]

Torque converters work by shearing the fluid when they can't stall, that makes a huge amount of heat. A high stall converter makes a lot more heat than a low stall converter as "stall" is basically the RPM when the converter stops shearing the fluid. Any HP generated, but not used, is converted into heat in the ATF. Since the exit port is usually fluid right out of the converter that kind of temp doesn't surprise me at all.
Water brake dynometers work the same way, they convert the HP into heat in the water. I was stunned to do the calcs with a little dyno and 300 gallons of water. A full throttle dyno pass did not need very long to take 300 gallons of ~70° water to boiling.

 

[ba123]

Good to know. I just need to figure out how to cool it then. Might have to try to squeeze it in another spot if this doesn’t work.

 

[ntsqd]

Find a place for the 6.0 PSD ATF cooler? They're ginormous.

 

[ba123]

There is absolutely nowhere I could fit that.

My engine is moved FORWARD to fit my intake and no spare room.

This cooler is massive for a trans cooler, was expensive as hell, and should work somewhere.

 

[ntsqd]

I posted that mostly as sarcasm. I'm not sure one would fit ANY EB.

Curious which cooler it is that you have. Posted a mfg & p/n before?

 

[ba123]

Yes, Derale 65861.

https://derale.com/product-footer/fluid-coolers/remote-mount-cooers/hi-flow-racing/65860-detail

Does not get any “cooler” than this thing. I could try to upgrade the Spal fan and maybe get a little but need more room to do that also, which I don’t have. And I can’t find much better.

There is a chance I could move my PS cooler and mount this right under the radiator:

I think it would fit but I’d have to make a mount and run all new lines and the what if it doesn’t make any difference?

Or maybe right here if I make a mount to mount it sideways and move my eStopp:

Maybe…gotta measure more, but maybe a chance for here on the drivers side above the power step.

 

[ntsqd]

According to my handy desktop units conversion application 125,000 BTU/H is ~49 HP worth of heat.

 

[ba123]

I went for a drive and it seemed to cool…a little. I did get it to 208° and then it came down to 201° but that was when stopped and driving slowly that it came down.

When home, I looked around a bit and measured some temps and man, I did not realize my muffler got that much hotter than my pipes. Pies are around 200° and muffler was at 450°!

The external sides of the cooler, even on the muffler side were around 175° but still.

I think I’m going to try heat wrapping the muffler.

 

[Broncobowsher]

Nothing crazy…e303.

When I first finished the build I did have a temp sensor in the cooling out port and the temps hit like 280° after a 20-30 minute drive.

It’s weird that it gets this hot imo and don’t understand.

That is convertor out temp. What was the pan temp? That is what the clutches and seals really see. If you want to get real nerdy about it, what was the temp of the return out of the cooler?

One of the things I did to the 4R70W was add a foot operated button that would let me lock the convertor. Running low speeds in 2nd or 3rd gear, but loading the engine a bit. The convertor was doing the slip thing, but I could lock it up and kill the slip and heat.

 

[ba123]

That is convertor out temp. What was the pan temp? That is what the clutches and seals really see. If you want to get real nerdy about it, what was the temp of the return out of the cooler?

One of the things I did to the 4R70W was add a foot operated button that would let me lock the convertor. Running low speeds in 2nd or 3rd gear, but loading the engine a bit. The convertor was doing the slip thing, but I could lock it up and kill the slip and heat.

Yes, and that’s why I moved the temp sensor to the pan and the pan got to whatever crazy temp I said the other day…246° I think.

And I think the problem must be that the air around the cooler is not cool and so it isn’t cooling. I ordered a muffler shield and will see if that makes a difference otherwise I’ll either have to build a box with a scoop around this cooler to isolate it or find another spot.

I really love honey AOD drives right now but if I can’t get this how I want it, I might have to go 4R70W like you.

 

[ntsqd]

Shortly after it was discovered that a simple switch could lock a 700R4's converter there was a high number of burnt-up 700R4's. Be careful with force-ably locking converters.

Excepting the forced converter locking I don't see any cooling demand that is different between the AOD and the 4R70W.

A demonstration of the rate of the reaction when two different temperature fluids come into contact was given in my High School ROP class. They'd likely hang the instructor for doing it now, but he put two styrofoam cups full of liquid R12 refrigerant on a work bench. Then he poured cold water out of the cooler into one of those cups of R12 and it made the coolest looking ice sculpture that I've ever seen. Then he poured some nearly boiling hot water into the other cup of R12. Bare in mind that R12's boiling point is far below ambient temperature, so it's boiling just sitting there in the cup. The hot water hitting the R12 blew the cup apart. Little pieces of it everywhere, no water or R12 to be found - both were vaporized (& likely inhaled - but that's a different problem).
Think about how this applies to things like heat exchangers and how it affects their efficiency.

 

[bronco italiano]

I went for a drive and it seemed to cool…a little. I did get it to 208° and then it came down to 201° but that was when stopped and driving slowly that it came down.

When home, I looked around a bit and measured some temps and man, I did not realize my muffler got that much hotter than my pipes. Pies are around 200° and muffler was at 450°!

The external sides of the cooler, even on the muffler side were around 175° but still.

I think I’m going to try heat wrapping the muffler.

I thermal barrier coated my entire exhaust inside/out to help reduce heat. That muffler of yours is really hot!!

 

[ntsqd]

Some time ago the FlowMaster on the Ranchero really impressed me with how hot it normally ran. I thought it was an FM thing for years. I've since come to realize that they're all like that. Is it possible that the muffling process turns noise into heat? Or is it simply that a muffler has a LOT more radiant surface area than the exhaust plumbing?

 

[ba123]

I thermal barrier coated my entire exhaust inside/out to help reduce heat. That muffler of yours is really hot!!

Yeah, buddy, I remember and am jealous! If I ever get my exhaust system exactly how I want it and then have time to send stuff off, I might do the same but seems like I'll never be there.

Some time ago the FlowMaster on the Ranchero really impressed me with how hot it normally ran. I thought it was an FM thing for years. I've since come to realize that they're all like that. Is it possible that the muffling process turns noise into heat? Or is it simply that a muffler has a LOT more radiant surface area than the exhaust plumbing?

Yes, it's crazy! I looked it up and it says it can get up to 600° when running hard. Being that far away from the engine and that incredibly hot is nuts. I'm thinking maybe I need to also make a shield on the muffler side of the cooler that's in addition to the muffler shield.

At this point it is making total sense why my cooler cannot cool, but I guess I'll see what the change it with shield #1. I just wish I had realized this sooner.

 

[ntsqd]

While you're thinking about heat shields consider what the radiant heat is doing to the temp in the cab. I know one fellow member here who might say that heat-shielding the exhaust from the floor was transformative.

 

[bronco italiano]

Yeah, buddy, I remember and am jealous! If I ever get my exhaust system exactly how I want it and then have time to send stuff off, I might do the same but seems like I'll never be there.


Yes, it's crazy! I looked it up and it says it can get up to 600° when running hard. Being that far away from the engine and that incredibly hot is nuts. I'm thinking maybe I need to also make a shield on the muffler side of the cooler that's in addition to the muffler shield.

At this point it is making total sense why my cooler cannot cool, but I guess I'll see what the change it with shield #1. I just wish I had realized this sooner.

Take that exhaust off and I will take it to Fresno for you. They do really nice work

 

[ba123]

While you're thinking about heat shields consider what the radiant heat is doing to the temp in the cab. I know one fellow member here who might say that heat-shielding the exhaust from the floor was transformative.

I really don't feel any heat in the cab but I bet anyone who sits above that muffler would! I was planning on shielding the top and cooler side of the muffler so it should take care of that.

Take that exhaust off and I will take it to Fresno for you. They do really nice work

I might take you up on that when I'm ready. I still have a temporary exhaust connector that I need to get made correctly. After I do that and know my trans heat is under control, I might need you. Thanks!