front disc brake help

[zman1971]

I recently bought a disc brake kit from one of the vendors and the instructions are a little vague, my question is on the spindle seal, they give you two different styles to choose from and a nylon spacer, they say to use the nylon spacer with the latter style (accordion rubber type) seal. My question is mine had the brass spacers with the early (press in type) seal, so do I just leave out the spacers?

 

[dave67fd]

I assume your reffering to the thrust washer? if so you need it. I believe your copper one gets replaced with the Nylon.

Watch at about 3:15
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8VvWV6_rAns&index=8&list=PLrGrNjINL720r8KIwYLoSUOqMzsUG_qZi

 

[zman1971]

yes I am talking about the thrust washer, in that video it is a dana 30 if that matters? but yes that's the way I will install it, its just that they say that the thrust washer goes with the other(latter) seal and not the press in type and to discard it if it is the press in type. mine is a dana 44 and had the press in type with the thrust washer so I will use the washer but they installed the press in seal already so hopefully I can get them out without destroying them to get the washer in first.

 

[Pa PITT]

... I watched that .. I guess just to see it. I must have packed 50 sets of those bearing & seals .. I must have been doing it wrong for years.
... My SBK1 SEALS KITS HAVE NEVER GONE IN like he was showing .
...........
................ & That lock ring that goes between those 2 big nuts that holds it all together. That lock ring in the center .. If it wont fit onto the pin its possible to flip it over & the hole are just about a 1/2 hole off that it'll then just slip right into place .
.... I've never seen that back off 90* before .. But that's done a lot on farm implement bearing that are all new bearings.
... I've just tried to tighten mine about 5 or 10 lbs more than the inside bearing nut.

 

[DirtDonk]

If you still have the old bronze thrust washers in good shape, there's no reason you couldn't re-use them if you preferred. The nylon was simply a reasonably good and less expensive replacement. Both do the same work.

And if you had the thrust washer, theoretically you also had the later style with the floating "V" or bellows seal and small spindle bearing seal. Since yours had both (I noticed, after re-reading!) then you should keep the seal pressed in the spindle and still use the thrust washer I would say. Unless someone placed it there by mistake during a previous service maybe?
According to our instructions then (http://cdn.wildhorses4x4.com/downloads/WH/3002-3003 2-1-11.pdf), you would re-use that type of setup even with the new spindles. At that point, it's about the outer axle shaft itself needing the type of seal setup it was designed to work with that makes your decision for you.
Since most, if no all of the new spindles are set up with the deep recess to accept the press-in seals, we install them in all kit's replacement spindles prior to shipment.
Ours is certainly open to certain interpretations, so if that's one of our kits, sorry 'bout that!

If your original setup was for the press-in seal then, you simply leave it in place and go from there. If you need to seat it farther in to fit your particular axle better, it's ok to do so. But it should work just fine as you receive it.
If your original setup was for the floating seals, then remove the press-in seal, discard it and make sure to install the floaters as they were originally.
Using the bronze original, or plastic replacement thrust washers is up to you as well. I've done both and have never had a problem with either type.

Finding early design spindles and outer axle shafts is a very hard proposition these days. Apparently it was a running change made by Dana/Spicer and the supply of old design stuff was just left to dwindle instead of keeping up with future needs.

If this was one of our kits zman, sorry about not being clearer in writing. If it was one of the other vendors, you could call to let them know there was a question and maybe they can clear it up as well.
And hopefully we both have the same answer!!!;D

Paul

 

[DirtDonk]

Oh, and regarding the adjustment procedure, there has only ever been one proscribed method of adjusting wheel bearings on the front axles. The video is mostly correct, but has some glaring mis-steps as well. So you might be more correct than you think Pa Pitt.

The 50lb tight spec, then backing off a quarter turn thing is partly for new setups, but is also appropriate for any re-packed bearing. It's specified in their instructions as something to always do, probably for both reasons.
Not only will it help square up and seat a new bearing race that's not quite at full depth, but also serves to squeeze out any excess grease that might skew the readings on a dial-indicator. Which they're expecting you to use to check your preload/freeplay, but which most don't do I'm guessing.

A few pounds of excess preload on the bearings likely won't kill anything on the farm, but it's at highway speeds for extended periods that a too-tight bearing could be trouble.
The outer lock nut getting torqued to 80-105 lbs is what cinches things down to a few thousandths free play and keeps things that way for the next 20 or 30 thousand miles.

Paul

 

[Jdgephar]

I've always assembled a Dana 44 like this. Thrust washer, slinger, and oil seal on the stub shaft. I don't know what's going on in that youtube video. That's a design I have not seen before.

 

[zman1971]

Thanks Dirt donk for the reply, yes it is one of your kits and I believe I have it figured out, basically as you described, it is a 69 with a dana 44 so who knows, I was just a little confused but am pleased with the kit and glad I did not try to piece it together. Again thanks for the replies.

 

[Pa PITT]

... Paul good explanation. Packing these bearing is a pain no 2 of us do them the same. I learned mine from 3 mechanic that worked at the ''Cadillac'' house .2 drove ford 4x4's & other drove the old GMC 4by Jimmy. We all hunted together & ran together in general. They all had different ways to pack & replace those seals & bearings.
.. Gm didn't sell the stub shaft but Ford did. So I had to go Buy it from the Ford house & sell it to my Buddies at the GM / CADDY house. I at my parts house bought them better than they could with their Caddy Logo.
........ Man those were the days.

 

[DirtDonk]

Should have mentioned that your setup sounds just like what the guy did in the video. Used both the early press-in seal with the later thrust washer. Never done that myself, but I don't see why it would not work, as not only does his float a little inside the seal, but you say yours was installed that way and (presumably) with no issues.

It's possible that the axle shaft will bottom out on the outer end of the seal before it actually needs the thrust washer up against the back of the spindle. But either one is a better sacrificial piece than a spindle or an axle shaft is!

By the way... Do your outer axle shafts also have the little sheet metal slingers (ring thingies) out on the flange near the u-joint?
Curious.

Thanks

Paul

 

[zman1971]

I installed then just like the video just because that's how the old ones came out, and yes my outer axle has the slinger thingy. Whats that mean?

 

[DirtDonk]

Just means that all of our historical info is not always correct and that running changes often include parts from both early and late designs.
Or things just get mixed up over the years.

Doesn't mean anything bad with regard to yours. I just prefer to think of it as you having all the good stuff!;D
I like slingers by their very nature. They're supposed to keep more stuff away from the critical rotating bits and pieces. Things like seals and the open ends of axle tubes.

Paul