Read to Run Dizzys

[tonytony9]

Has anyone had luck with the more economical read-to-run distributors? I am hunting down a few gremlins. Part of the hunt includes switching to an electronic ignition system. I have an original Autolite Dizzy, there appears to be play in the shaft. These are the DIzzys I am considering:

North East: https://www.northeastclassicfordpar...utor-ford-260-289-302-small-block-female-cap/
Or
Pertronix Flame Thrower Distributor

Any other economical options to consider?

 

[ntsqd]

Anytime something like that appears I think "they've cut corners somewhere to make it that price." I don't expect products like that to last very long or be very good, but no experience with that product.

I've built electronic ignitions for various engines using junk-yard sourced parts from various donors, but for Fords I've always used Ford's Dura-Spark II ignitions. They're a bit more wiring than some of the other options but they're solidly reliable when an OEM Ford module is used. And by that I mean an original module, not a new Motorcraft module.

Were I going to build an electronic ignition system now, given the sad reputation of the new modules, and if I couldn't source an original, I would use a GM HEI module, specifically one from Performance Distributor. That may be beyond what you're comfortable with. I'm a fan of the GM HEI modules, but not the HEI distributors. I won't say that I'd never use an HEI dist. in a Ford, but it would be some extenuating circumstances to cause me to do that.

 

[pcf_mark]

You get what you pay for. If you never venture far from home, have AAA, use any of them. For lowest cost reliability (and not cheap either) use a Ford points distributor to trigger and MSD (not counterfeit). They fire hard and fast and are very hearty. HOWEVER if the MSD craps out you can flip two wires and drive home on points.

Ultra reliable is EDIS from Ford but any solution using that is not cheap by nature. I went that route and forget I have ignition it just always works.

 

[ntsqd]

In the old days MSD was a quality name. Post acquisition not so much any more. Merely my saying that is likely to bring out the haters.

Real OEM parts are held a much higher standard than 99.9% of the aftermarket.

 

[SteveL]

The dui's aren't cheap but hard to beat the quality. Also great customer service if you do have any problems

 

[bronco italiano]

The dui's aren't cheap but hard to beat the quality. Also great customer service if you do have any problems

100%. They still need some fine tuning if you want them super sweet. Why not take the current distributor, send it to Wes Adams at Hillside auto/AmsOil dealer in Klamath Falls, OR. He is the FE distributor guru but does all Fords and is VERY reasonable. He just did 3 distributors for me (2- FE and 1-Pontiac big block).

 

[tonytony9]

100%. They still need some fine tuning if you want them super sweet. Why not take the current distributor, send it to Wes Adams at Hillside auto/AmsOil dealer in Klamath Falls, OR. He is the FE distributor guru but does all Fords and is VERY reasonable. He just did 3 distributors for me (2- FE and 1-Pontiac big block).

You get what you pay for. If you never venture far from home, have AAA, use any of them. For lowest cost reliability (and not cheap either) use a Ford points distributor to trigger and MSD (not counterfeit). They fire hard and fast and are very hearty. HOWEVER if the MSD craps out you can flip two wires and drive home on points.

Ultra reliable is EDIS from Ford but any solution using that is not cheap by nature. I went that route and forget I have ignition it just always works.

The dui's aren't cheap but hard to beat the quality. Also great customer service if you do have any problems

Thanks for the input guys.

I think I’m going to stick my stock dizzy, inspect, and send it off for some tlc. I’ll run a Pertronix ll module.

I am confused how to wire it up if I want to continue using my Napa Echlin coil. I just got it and would hate to waste the $$ on the flame thrower if I don’t have to.

The Napa coil is a 12v external resistor coil. So right now I have it running off the stock resistance wire.

I know I should supply the Pertronix with 12v. So, could I run the stock resistance wire to the coil, “daisy chain” it after the coil to a relay, then the relay hooked to the battery to grab the 12v and send it directly to the Pertronix?

I would like to avoid running a new wire from the ignition if I can use a relay, but not sure the optimal way to go.

 

[DirtDonk]

A relay is fine. Or you could tap into the green with red striped voltage regulator wire.
But I’m not sure that would be any easier than tapping into the ignition switch. However, if you no longer have an external voltage regulator, that wire is not doing anything and it comes off the same contact in the ignition switch as does your resistor wire.
A wire off the coil to control a relay would be simple. An additional potential failure point, but simple and probably as reliable as any other solution.

 

[Oldtimer]

Tony,
It appears you havea 70 Bronco?
If wire harness is stock, I would:

• Get key on 12v from RD/GN stripe wire at the voltage regulator, use it to trigger a relay,
• Get 12v supply from B+ post on starter relay, add a fuse, and use relay to send it to the Pertronix box.

What Paul said, he types faster than me

 

[ntsqd]

For this use I'd go with a self re-setting breaker instead of a fuse.

 

[DirtDonk]

But that’s only because you put in more useful information than I do!

 

[bronco italiano]

Pertronix I is fine unless you have the lower ohm coils that pertronix recommends with the II (0.6 ohm) and III (0.32 ohm) versions. Pertronix I is perfect for what you are doing, just run 12v to the unit

 

[tonytony9]

Tony,
It appears you havea 70 Bronco?
If wire harness is stock, I would:

• Get key on 12v from RD/GN stripe wire at the voltage regulator, use it to trigger a relay,
• Get 12v supply from B+ post on starter relay, add a fuse, and use relay to send it to the Pertronix box.

View attachment 952591

What Paul said, he types faster than me

A relay is fine. Or you could tap into the green with red striped voltage regulator wire.
But I’m not sure that would be any easier than tapping into the ignition switch. However, if you no longer have an external voltage regulator, that wire is not doing anything and it comes off the same contact in the ignition switch as does your resistor wire.
A wire off the coil to control a relay would be simple. An additional potential failure point, but simple and probably as reliable as any other solution.

For this use I'd go with a self re-setting breaker instead of a fuse.

Pertronix I is fine unless you have the lower ohm coils that pertronix recommends with the II (0.6 ohm) and III (0.32 ohm) versions. Pertronix I is perfect for what you are doing, just run 12v to the unit

Is this the voltage regulator you are referring to? And in the photo, I drew a red arrow to I believe the Green with red stripe wire you are referencing.

 

[DirtDonk]

Yes.

 

[DirtDonk]

But second guessing here, the older the harness and the older the Bronco, the more likely the voltage regulator wire is to have reduced current capacity. Which might negatively affect the new HEI distributor.
There is a chance that it’s perfectly fine, but it might be better to use the relay option here.

Anyone know what the actual current draw is for a GM HEI setup?
All I know is that they spec’ed a larger than normal supply wire. Can’t really imagine what components in there draw a lot of current, but GM normally wouldn’t waste larger wire if it wasn’t necessary.
That’s really only what’s making me question your agreeing with red wire. It’s original, the vehicle is old, the firewall connectors might be compromised, etc.
If you are able to test everything and measure voltages ahead of time, that would be good.
Otherwise, when in doubt, use the relay.

And here, with a relay, you can use the green with red wire no problem, or the red with green wire at the existing coil no problem. Just a matter of deciding, which one is most convenient. Or in the best shape.

If you’re not sure how to hook up a relay, if you decide to go that way, we can walk you through it.

 

[ntsqd]

GM uses a 12 ga ignition power supply wire. I don't know what the actual draw is, but that wire size tells me that it is significant. I would never run an HEI off of any smaller wire and I think that in any vehicle whose ignition switch wasn't made with that kind of power flowing thru it in mind that a relay is a requirement. I used a relay to power the HEI conversion of my '73 C10 SBSS because even though the ignition switch was probably designed with an eventual HEI in mind, the truck wasn't wired correctly for one.

I would use a breaker like this one: https://www.napaonline.com/en/p/BK_7823105 placed near/next to the battery to power the ignition. I'd put the relay beside the breaker.

 

[tonytony9]

But second guessing here, the older the harness and the older the Bronco, the more likely the voltage regulator wire is to have reduced current capacity. Which might negatively affect the new HEI distributor.
There is a chance that it’s perfectly fine, but it might be better to use the relay option here.

Anyone know what the actual current draw is for a GM HEI setup?
All I know is that they spec’ed a larger than normal supply wire. Can’t really imagine what components in there draw a lot of current, but GM normally wouldn’t waste larger wire if it wasn’t necessary.
That’s really only what’s making me question your agreeing with red wire. It’s original, the vehicle is old, the firewall connectors might be compromised, etc.
If you are able to test everything and measure voltages ahead of time, that would be good.
Otherwise, when in doubt, use the relay.

And here, with a relay, you can use the green with red wire no problem, or the red with green wire at the existing coil no problem. Just a matter of deciding, which one is most convenient. Or in the best shape.

If you’re not sure how to hook up a relay, if you decide to go that way, we can walk you through it.

GM uses a 12 ga ignition power supply wire. I don't know what the actual draw is, but that wire size tells me that it is significant. I would never run an HEI off of any smaller wire and I think that in any vehicle whose ignition switch wasn't made with that kind of power flowing thru it in mind that a relay is a requirement. I used a relay to power the HEI conversion of my '73 C10 SBSS because even though the ignition switch was probably designed with an eventual HEI in mind, the truck wasn't wired correctly for one.

I would use a breaker like this one: https://www.napaonline.com/en/p/BK_7823105 placed near/next to the battery to power the ignition. I'd put the relay beside the breaker.

I am going to the garage now and will get as many pictures as possible to help illustrate. For the time being, does this setup sound correct?:

Run a power supply off the positive terminal on my optima yellow top to a breaker. Located next to/near the battery. Then, run that to the relay. Off the positive terminal of the coil (where the ignition resistance wire is run to), run a wire to the relay. Off the relay will be another wire which runs directly to my Pertronix module (1,2, or 3 whichever way I go).

The relay gets its full 12v from the battery, and the wire running off the coil to the relay is pretty much acting as a "trigger." Do not send 12v power to pertronix unless ignition is keyed on.

Si?

 

[ntsqd]

Did not realize that a Pertronix was the choice. I was responding specifically to using an GM designed HEI distributor that has been modified to work in a Ford engine.

I would wire a Pertronix exactly how they say to do so. No idea what that might be.

 

[Oldtimer]

And the relay will also need a ground wire.

 

[DirtDonk]

Yeah, I was thinking of something else as well when I talked about the HEI. Sorry about the confusion.
A Pertronix ignitor doesn’t require as much current as a GM HEI distributor does. You can run it straight off of your green with red wire from the voltage regulator without a relay.
If you, for convenience sake, want to run it off the red with green wire from the coil, then yes you need to use that wire to trigger a relay because that wire is low-voltage.
The coil remains on the low-voltage wire, while the distributors red wire runs off the relay.

Otherwise, as you say,
Battery to circuit breaker, circuit breaker to PIN #30 on the relay.
Pin #87 to the Red wire on the distributor.
Pin #85 to ground.
Pin #86 to the Red wire/green stripe wire tied to the coil.