What is the latest and greatest EFI

[ba123]

As mentioned, the PimpX from Stinger. But AFAIK it is speed density only. I have been considering making my own circuit boards for Mega Squirt on my little cnc router as a replacement for the Explorer PCM since it would be fully tunable, but it looks like it would be pretty expensive by the time 4r70w control was added in.

You can run the maf if you want to with the PiMPxs. It does support it, they just say there’s no need for it and you can get a better tune without it. I don’t remember all the details but I decided not to use my maf and hope I’m not disappointed.

Lemme try to find the info I had.

 

[EFI Guy]

I like that you get fresh connectors with RF. I don't like generic wire colors, and I really don't like their panel. I also prefer that the PCM be in control of the FP relay rather than ignition hot. An RF kit and a bunch of EEC-V virgin pis would still be the best way to have a "new" EEC-V harness, just lose the bus panel.

 

[EFI Guy]

You can run the maf if you want to with the PiMPxs. It does support it, they just say there’s no need for it and you can get a better tune without it. I don’t remember all the details but I decided not to use my maf and hope I’m not disappointed.

Lemme try to find the info I had.

Interesting. It seems the GM guys like to only use MAP as well, I'm not sure why they like to delete a perfectly good MAF but they often do.

 

[ba123]

I like that you get fresh connectors with RF. I don't like generic wire colors, and I really don't like their panel. I also prefer that the PCM be in control of the FP relay rather than ignition hot. An RF kit and a bunch of EEC-V virgin pis would still be the best way to have a "new" EEC-V harness, just lose the bus panel.

I HATE the panel. It’s unecessarily huge. I build electrical boxes just because of all this crap I have.


For the MAF discussion, I found this:
“When the ECU is not tuneable, MAF is superior as it can adjust for variables you can't tune for (mods, sensors wearing out, engine degradation over time, etc.). When you have an ECU that's completely tuneable that benefit goes away since you can tune for mods, see when sensors are wearing out and replace them, etc.
Nothing is measuring airflow with an SD system. The MAP is measuring pressure/load (vacuum/boost) which is what's used to determine fuel and spark requirements. “

From here: https://stinger-performance.proboards.com/thread/5914/pimpxs-support-maf

With the Stinger or MS3, you can have it control whatever you want. I have it controlling my electronic fan even.

 

[EFI Guy]

It would seem to me that you would still have much more Load resolution using a MAF than you would a MAP. One of these days I'm going to have to take an MS3 unit for a test drive.
I dabbled with the MS stuff in the very early days, it seems they have come a very long way since then.

 

[ba123]

It would seem to me that you would still have much more Load resolution using a MAF than you would a MAP. One of these days I'm going to have to take an MS3 unit for a test drive.
I dabbled with the MS stuff in the very early days, it seems they have come a very long way since then.

I think they have and I think you should. The. You could expand your scope of business to selling tuned MS units with whatever people want. (I’d assume, since your not removing anything from a production ecu).

 

[lars]

I HATE the panel. It’s unecessarily huge. I build electrical boxes just because of all this crap I have.
View attachment 908964

For the MAF discussion, I found this:
“When the ECU is not tuneable, MAF is superior as it can adjust for variables you can't tune for (mods, sensors wearing out, engine degradation over time, etc.). When you have an ECU that's completely tuneable that benefit goes away since you can tune for mods, see when sensors are wearing out and replace them, etc.
Nothing is measuring airflow with an SD system. The MAP is measuring pressure/load (vacuum/boost) which is what's used to determine fuel and spark requirements. “

From here: https://stinger-performance.proboards.com/thread/5914/pimpxs-support-maf

With the Stinger or MS3, you can have it control whatever you want. I have it controlling my electronic fan even.

But can it control your margarita blender…


Sorry, been one of those days…

 

[ba123]

But can it control your margarita blender…


Sorry, been one of those days…

That’s a great question but it shouldn’t be in reach and not sure I want my margaritas made in my engine bay.

You could totally set up a blender that’s either run by a relay or pwm for that just perfect smoothness if you like yours blended. Mine should be rocks, salt, no kid. 2 shots patron silver, 1 shot citronge or the other one, and some fresh lime or half lime/lemon is good too.

 

[73azbronco]

Good question. Haven’t heard of any, but they might be out there.
Are you thinking stock components, stock tune, and all that?

One that I can think of that aftermarket is the Pimp X from Stinger Performance. It’s an aftermarket computer inside of Ford case with Ford connector.
So it connects right to a stock harness, but is pre-tuned to a certain level to your specifications. And if you get the software you can, even tune it yourself after the fact.

Sounds like a great product, but at least one member here has tried it and found the bass tune not that great for their application.

Looked at pimp x, almost but no cigar. He does mustang stuff. Or F150/Big bronco which I suppose could be the 351.

Bad news, by the time I selected the options the cost hit $1,800. Near Proflow territory.

 

[ba123]

Looked at pimp x, almost but no cigar. He does mustang stuff. Or F150/Big bronco which I suppose could be the 351.

Bad news, by the time I selected the options the cost hit $1,800. Near Proflow territory.

It’s only that much if you go with the expansion harness and coil near plug with coils (which is what I did).

And I’m not a fan of pro flow or any of those. It’s a carb with fuel injectors.

 

[duffymahoney]

Emtron is planning on lauching a budget ecu, that calculates air volume, I might be a test person for them. Without kno

It’s only that much if you go with the expansion harness and coil near plug with coils (which is what I did).

And I’m not a fan of pro flow or any of those. It’s a carb with fuel injectors.

Well pro flow is at least port injected. The rest are a smart carb

 

[nvrstuk]

Hi, is there a plug and play replacement A9L like computer, all new?

Yes, ProM has it and it is Mass Air.

I was told twice by whoever answers the phone at ProM that it was out of a late model Mustang ( I even have the notes from the phone call). Be a bit tough to make two phone calls, ask the SAME question about the ECU and then write down the wrong answer twice- about 100% sure I didn't do that! lol

Then some guy jumped my case on Corral when I was asking about tuning and he said it was from a race engine they developed (or something- don't care). The case looks identical to an A9l. The ProM employee and their website says it was/is designed and programmed by the same Ford gurus that did other Ford ecu's.

I have NO idea what it is but this was one of the systems I was looking at seriously until the descrepancies about the ecu and talking to guys that have dealt with Chris the owner and the number of guys that confessed that yes, sometimes it can take a LOT of dialing in after you receive it (their website says give them the specs, they program it and you are done (almost).

It takes their wiring (no warranty without), etc, etc You can check out their site.

 

[chuck1022]

EFIGUY wrote -So my policy is to limit tuning to PATS deletes

What are PATS?

EFIGUY wrote- The EGR and CATS really are not that hard to adapt in. I Like to run CATS

I want CATS too, not a fan of the stink either.

EGR- would you even notice a deleted EGR VS non deleted EGR? I don't notice when my EGR valves open now?

 

[EFI Guy]

EFIGUY wrote -So my policy is to limit tuning to PATS deletes

What are PATS?

EFIGUY wrote- The EGR and CATS really are not that hard to adapt in. I Like to run CATS

I want CATS too, not a fan of the stink either.

EGR- would you even notice a deleted EGR VS non deleted EGR? I don't notice when my EGR valves open now?

PATS = Passive Anti Theft System, present on 98-01 MY Explorers. I usually delete this with a reflash, that allows the engine to run without the need for a chipped key. It can be left in but you need some additional parts all from the same matching donor and wiring in a couple of modules. Otherwise, more programming will be needed for the system to work.

The main function of EGR is to reduce NOX emissions, but using it will net you a small mpg increase during lean cruise. The only reason not to run it is hood clearance. The EGR elbow on the Explorers put the throttle body pretty far forward which probably isn't a problem with a body lift or aftermarket hood, but not likely to clear with everything stock. The 96 EGR is very easy to run using a Mustang EGR spacer and should clear just fine. The later Explorers with DPFE style EGR would take some additional fabrication to plumb it into a Mustang spacer. The only other downside is the EGR ports typically start to carbon up after 150k miles or so. But cleaning them is not hard to do.

 

[EFI Guy]

Yes, ProM has it and it is Mass Air.

I was told twice by whoever answers the phone at ProM that it was out of a late model Mustang ( I even have the notes from the phone call). Be a bit tough to make two phone calls, ask the SAME question about the ECU and then write down the wrong answer twice- about 100% sure I didn't do that! lol

Then some guy jumped my case on Corral when I was asking about tuning and he said it was from a race engine they developed (or something- don't care). The case looks identical to an A9l. The ProM employee and their website says it was/is designed and programmed by the same Ford gurus that did other Ford ecu's.

I have NO idea what it is but this was one of the systems I was looking at seriously until the descrepancies about the ecu and talking to guys that have dealt with Chris the owner and the number of guys that confessed that yes, sometimes it can take a LOT of dialing in after you receive it (their website says give them the specs, they program it and you are done (almost).

It takes their wiring (no warranty without), etc, etc You can check out their site.

The first ProM units were absolutely an A9X variant with a Moates chip and a GM MAF located above their throttlebody.
They updated that system later using what I suspect was a Saab computer with their own OS on it, but I can't confirm that. It would make sense because SAAB became cheap and easy to tune when they went out of business and swaps using Saab computers became popular in Europe.

The one you have linked to now absolutely looks like the current Coyote computers. It would not be a direct replacement for an A9L. But using their harness makes it a viable option. They have probably simplified the OS substantially without the need for drive-by-wire. It would be very much like tuning an A9L I suspect. The only downside is those computers usually take 4 to 7 minutes for a flash to burn in, so tuning it would probably take quite a bit longer than the instant changes you get with a QH. Being that it's probably sourced from the same supplier as Ford I would expect it to be reliable. I do occasionally see coil pack or injector drivers burn up in that generation of computers though. I'd still trust it more than any other aftermarket unit.

 

[bmc69]

PATS = Passive Anti Theft System, present on 98-01 MY Explorers. I usually delete this with a reflash, that allows the engine to run without the need for a chipped key. It can be left in but you need some additional parts all from the same matching donor and wiring in a couple of modules. Otherwise, more programming will be needed for the system to work.

The main function of EGR is to reduce NOX emissions, but using it will net you a small mpg increase during lean cruise. The only reason not to run it is hood clearance. The EGR elbow on the Explorers put the throttle body pretty far forward which probably isn't a problem with a body lift or aftermarket hood, but not likely to clear with everything stock. The 96 EGR is very easy to run using a Mustang EGR spacer and should clear just fine. The later Explorers with DPFE style EGR would take some additional fabrication to plumb it into a Mustang spacer. The only other downside is the EGR ports typically start to carbon up after 150k miles or so. But cleaning them is not hard to do.

I'm copying that post. I get so sick and tired of trying to explain to rubes on the FB groups I admin that "EGR not bad. EGR good. Harrumph". All the rubes are out there chanting in unison, "Its smog stuff..get rid of it".

 

[ssray]

Being that it's probably sourced from the same supplier as Ford I would expect it to be reliable.

I was studying some of the info on Pro M and Motec a while back and I think the current Pro M boards are manufactured and programmed by the same entity that does Fords. I’ll see if I can find that.

From Pro M:
”The Pro-M EFI PCM is essentially a production Ford module. It is made on the same assembly line as the Ford ones are. It goes through all the same rigorous testing as the Ford modules. You'd be surprised what they put these through… Our modules share no code whatsoever with the production Ford modules, but our code is written by Ford contractors. You simply cannot do better than that. Why do we do this? We assure you, it's not because they are inexpensive. They are anything but. We do it because they are the best. Period...l”

 

[ba123]

I'm copying that post. I get so sick and tired of trying to explain to rubes on the FB groups I admin that "EGR not bad. EGR good. Harrumph". All the rubes are out there chanting in unison, "Its smog stuff..get rid of it".

I would’ve kept my egr if I could. I had planned to but I just don’t have room and it doesn’t fit the look either. I agree that you should keep it if you can. I got a really nice BBK 75mm EGR spacer I had planned on using.

I was studying some of the info on Pro M and Motec a while back and I think the current Pro M boards are manufactured and programmed by the same entity that does Fords. I’ll see if I can find that.

From Pro M:
”The Pro-M EFI PCM is essentially a production Ford module. It is made on the same assembly line as the Ford ones are. It goes through all the same rigorous testing as the Ford modules. You'd be surprised what they put these through… Our modules share no code whatsoever with the production Ford modules, but our code is written by Ford contractors. You simply cannot do better than that. Why do we do this? We assure you, it's not because they are inexpensive. They are anything but. We do it because they are the best. Period...l”

Shocker that someone thinks his own product is the best. I did look at Pro-m, I spent the same amount elsewhere with all the extras I got for a reason. I can’t remember all the reasons, but I made those decisions and pretty sure I’ll be happy with that.

 

[nvrstuk]

I just want something that will be around in 20 yrs... heck, I live in WA State and these idiots want us all to have electric everything so maybe gas engines won't be allowed in our State or they will pass ANOTHER carbon tax so not only will we pay the most in the nation for gas but maybe we can be paying TWICE what the national average is.

I can see us towing a horse trailer with the pickup and stopping every 100 miles to charge for an hour... Horses love STANDING in the trailer waiting... lol they'll kick the sides out of the trailer while waiting.

 

[Yeller]

Horses are a good point, those folks pushing, need to make a cross country trip on one