Front end alignment help needed

[Rox Crusher]

I am anxious reading this thread..........I just ordered long arms and 4 degree bushings (as recommended by JD installation instructions for 3.5” lift).

After I ordered I remembered that I had swapped my front springs for 4.5” to counter a bit of rake in my Broncos stance. The 3.5” springs had settled which resulted in the rake.

Now I’m wondering if I should order new 7 degree bushings (which is what is currently in it) or use the 4 degree bushings ?

Any advice would be appreciated.

 

[Fitz24]

Here are some pictures of C Bushings. Best I could get with tires still on.

 

[DirtDonk]

Now I’m wondering if I should order new 7 degree bushings (which is what is currently in it) or use the 4 degree bushings?

Any advice would be appreciated.

Best advice I can give now is to get the caster measured BEFORE pulling it apart for the long-arms and bushings. Then at least you'll know what you're currently dealing with, to give you a better idea of what you need going forward.
Assuming it's still drivable that is?

Oh, and post up a pic of your "before" pinion angle too.

Thanks

Paul

 

[DirtDonk]

Here are some pictures of C Bushings. Best I could get with tires still on.

Actually pretty good pics considering all the obstacles you have to work around!
Unfortunately it's hard to tell. Either the Duff bushings have wider flanges, or those are not 7 degree bushings.
First they do not look like they're pushing the axle back as much as normal, but mainly because you can't see much of the inner surface pushing against the pad.

The passenger side front is the only one that shows a bit of the offset face (inside surface) and it does not look like much.
The passenger side rear shows some whitish stuff (is that grease?) but it's showing more of it on the bottom than the top, which makes it look like the rear bushing is in upside down.

Maybe someone has better eyes than mine and can determine what you have from the pics.

Paul

 

[Fitz24]

The Duff C bushings have "bottom front" and "bottom rear" denoted on each piece so really believe they are in correctly. Now, not sure I remember seeing anything showing what degree bushings they were other than shipping list. Maybe they aren't 7 degree.

The white is a little lithium grease to help seat the bushings easier.

 

[DirtDonk]

They still could be 7's and I'm just not seeing the offset. But they certainly don't look the part yet.
Maybe someone else with the same ones can comment.

But the bottom line as far as your rig goes is that, no matter what you do, if you want more caster and still have the best pinion angle, you're going to have to cut-n-turn the steering yokes.
Granted, you have plenty of rotation left before you have a binding issue with the u-joint, but that's only helpful if it turns out you don't have the 7 degree bushings. The only other common method (the eccentrics) will only net you an additional 1.5 degrees and that's not enough to put you in the sweet spot.
So if you wanted to try to get more out of the bushings only you'll have to pull one side apart to verity that they're indeed 7's, or not.

If they're not, you're good to go to add 7 degree bushings to gain at least 3 more degrees. If they are already though, then you only have one more legitimate choice in the cutting and turning

Paul

 

[Crawdad]

Subscribed

 

[Broncobowsher]

It is hard to tell. But the first look of the driver's side front bushing looks to be upside down to me. Looks like the axle wedge is high in the bushing where it should be low in the bushing (for a front bushing).

 

[DirtDonk]

Maybe PM MonsterMike or Suzy (or just give Duff's a call) to see if they can either tell by the pics, or just look up your order to see which bushings were purchased?

Paul

 

[Fitz24]

I checked the Duff invoice for the C bushings order. The order was for 7* to use with Duff long arm order. Going to try to pull driverside apart tomorrow to double check.

 

[B0neCrush3r]

I haven't read this entire thread, so pardon me double posting anything.

After fiddling, took mine to my friends at the Ford dealership that works on all of the custom f250s. They have the fancy alignment equipment for big tires.

Rolls down I95 at 80 just fine. They didnt charge me, but I would happily spend the money to not have to mess with it.

 

[Authorizedcc]

I didn't think that Duffs 7% bushings came in blue, thought they only came in black.

 

[DirtDonk]

And I thought all Duff bushings were always blue. I wonder if they had a shortage of blue sometime and sent out black?
If not, that would certainly be one way of keeping track of offset ratings at a glance!

Paul

 

[Fitz24]

Called Duff's Friday. They said they sell 7* bushings in blue and black.

 

[DirtDonk]

Clears that up! Thanks for checking.

Paul

 

[Cecjap]

I was in the same boat

Seems like the same issue I had, 3.5 Duff suspension lift, 7 deg bushings, stock radius arms. I had a positive caster+1, drove like shit. Bought the short Trex arms which were supposed to be -4, only got me to -1.5, still drove bad. Ordered 2 and 4 deg bushings, cut and rotated C’s 9 deg, after a few attempts, reassembled with 2deg bushing upside down and now have -6 caster. The numbers from initial set up to final set up don’t add up, I believe the 7 deg bushings I used initially were not 7 deg bushings(were marked as 7).

 

[Fitz24]

Well, back went out a little over a week ago so have made no progress. Hope the pain goes soon. Want to get back at it soon.

 

[Fitz24]

Set Toe In

Finally got a chance to check the toe setting. Measured with the tires on and found it was really hard to get a good measurement. Kept getting a measurements that varied. Decided to remove tires and bolt angle stock to the rotors. Marked both sides 18" each way from center.

Measured front 62.5". Measured back 62 inches. So I've been driving it 10 years with a 1/2" of toe out. Could explain touchy steering. Setting as close to 1/8" as I can get with the helm setup.

 

[Fitz24]

What do I need to do to post pictures that aren't rotated 90*. Didn't do that until the last year or so.

 

[DirtDonk]

Well, mine never did it either until about two years ago or so. Now it does it about 25% of the time.

But just today I found a Settings box checked that said something like "auto-rotate when uploading" which I un-checked to see if that would take care of it.

I even thought, "ah-ha!" if this works I can tell everybody about it. But then, I'd have to remember where I found the box!:-[

Paul