Dan Wheeler's 69 4R70W/Atlas Build Thread

[Broncobowsher]

6 holes, 18k per mile. Right in the middle of that speedo's input range. shouldwork perfect.

 

[Lebe]

sounds pretty sweet - got any pics? how is your rear driveshaft angle? Do you know how much longer the 4 speed is compared to the 2 speed? I dont think i'd go 4 speed but I'm just curious.

Here's the pics. Sorry for the delay.

 

[Lebe]

Dan, you requested pics 10 days ago. The pics should work now.

 

[Broncobowsher]

thats awesome... could you safely down shift while the torque converter is locked? I have a bit of a guilty pleasure I will miss when going to an automatic - I like to pop the clutch when down shifting to make the rear tires chirp. The sudden rumble from the glass packs and the tires screeching at the same time is music to my ears.

so... i'm thinking I should be able to use one of these Nordskogg digital speedometers spliced into a wire on my OSS.

http://store.summitracing.com/partdetail.asp?autofilter=1&part=NRD%2DM9222%2DAS&N=700+4294925228+4294815743+4294895640+115&autoview=sku

That should work right? it has a calibration setting. Obviously it will be incorrect in low range but that doesn't matter.

I don't recall downshifting with the convertor locked. but I chirp them by downshifting and braking lightly. Can also chirp them going up into 2nd. I have done upshifts with the convertor locked, feels wierd and I don't do it that often but has not hurt anything. Might take a little life off the clutch packs doing that. Add a little line pressure at idle will help firm up the downshifts as well.

 

[MD]

here's a pic that shows the changes in 04

You can see the gears are extended to replace the 6 holes

This change is for the 4R75W not the 4R70W. The 4R70W may only have 6 holes for the OSS (for some reason I thought it was 8).

Michael

 

[DanWheeler]

Dan, you requested pics 10 days ago. The pics should work now.

wow, nice build, i see you went with the derale cooler also. Any particular reason you mounted it where you did?

do you have any pics from the side of the driveline angle? and of your transmission mount?

thanks,
dan

 

[DanWheeler]

3G alternator is in

now i've got enough juice to power the Derale transmission cooler which should go into place tomorrow.

I sent in the check for the Atlas. I decided on a 4.3 w/ 32 spline front output and the short tailhousing with no speedometer.

This should give me a mechanical crawl ratio of 60:1 not factoring in the torque converter.

I have everything but the t-case and a TPS sensor at this point. I need to call Baumann again the last time I talked to them on the phone they said their TPS sensor information is out of date. If anyone has good ideas on a TPS sensor for this swap I'd appreciate it. I see Summit Racing has several TPS sensors so I may get one of those. I'm still not entirely sure what the TPS sensor tells the transmission or what would happen without one.

Once I get the t-case I just need to pick a time when I can be without my truck for 1-2 weeks

 

[DanWheeler]

OOOOH YEAH! Giggity.

Just showed up today. My current clutch fork decided to take a "break" early so I'm starting in on this swap a little sooner than planned.

 

[DanWheeler]

OK, got the headers, clutch linkage, transmission, bellhousing, clutch, pressure plate, flywheel pulled out tonight. Things are looking good.

This is going to seem like a stupid question coming from a guy balls deep into an automatic swap but... how do I install the auto transmission, flywheel and torque converter?

Do I install the plate and flywheel on the back of the engine, put the torque converter on the transmission, slide things into place then attach the torque converter to the flywheel with the 4 nuts/bolts through the access hole in the bottom of the transmission?

Or do I install the plate and flywheel then attach the torque converter to the flywheel then slide the transmission on to that?

The latter uses less words to describe therefore it is easier that way?

either way, I can't believe those 4 little nuts/bolts are all that attaches the torque converter to the flywheel.

thanks,
dan

 

[1snowcat]

install motor plate and flex plate on back of motor and install torque conv on tranny than bolt up tranny to motor making sure to align studs as it goes together.... and yes nuts go on thru inspection cover after trans is bolted up...

 

[Tito]

Dont forget the torque converter usually seats about 3 levels, spin, spin spin, to get it to seat completely.

 

[DanWheeler]

thanks guys, and I read somewhere about filling the torque converter before you install it. Since mine is used, it already has fluid in it and I can't turn it vertically without a bunch of fluid spilling out. We thought we emptied it out before I bought it by turning it upside down but it still seems to have lots of fluid in there. How can I tell if I have enough fluid to start out with?

 

[DanWheeler]

btw - i found this youtube video that explains it pretty well. Only difference is I have a tiny little hole to work through once the transmission is installed

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vFFIPyv2C_4

 

[DanWheeler]

Just finished test fitting the transmission and headers this morning. It looks like I will just need to cut a tab off the 4R70W for the passenger side header to fit. I think the rest of it is going to be A-OK.

Passenger Side:

Driver's Side:

here's the biggest bummer I've found so far... it looks like my extended radius arm mounts are going to be right in the way of the Atlas which will require me to clock it down further than I'd like. It's gonna have to be a bit of a boat anchor until I can shorten the arms when I go 3-link later.

 

[DanWheeler]

picked up my throttle position sensor this morning. It's not quite what I expected even though the parts store said it's interchangeable with the TH31 recommended by the tech section on becontrols.com. The problem with this TPS is it has no lever. I had them find me a TPS from a 95 ford F-series and it was basically the same story.

This TPS was $40 at the local parts store. Not too bad relative to some of the other ones I've been quoted.

I guess I'm going to have to fab something up. I'm probably going to take a piece of round stock and cut some grooves into it and weld on a lever. Then I'll have to figure out a way to keep the lever and round piece from slipping out. I suppose I could just JB-weld it.

I also picked up some new motor mounts. After taking my headers off I could see that my existing motor mounts are in terrible shape. Now I need to go buy an engine hoist from harbor freight. It just keeps adding up.

 

[lars]

picked up my throttle position sensor this morning. It's not quite what I expected even though the parts store said it's interchangeable with the TH31 recommended by the tech section on becontrols.com. The problem with this TPS is it has no lever. I had them find me a TPS from a 95 ford F-series and it was basically the same story.

This TPS was $40 at the local parts store. Not too bad relative to some of the other ones I've been quoted.

I guess I'm going to have to fab something up. I'm probably going to take a piece of round stock and cut some grooves into it and weld on a lever. Then I'll have to figure out a way to keep the lever and round piece from slipping out. I suppose I could just JB-weld it.

I also picked up some new motor mounts. After taking my headers off I could see that my existing motor mounts are in terrible shape. Now I need to go buy an engine hoist from harbor freight. It just keeps adding up.

That looks exactly like the factory TPS on my Explorer throttle body. My throttle body has a flat blade on the end of the shaft that engages the plastic fins inside the TPS. Is your throttle body different?

As for your Atlas hanging too low, mine's clocked (I think) one position up from lowest. The t-case clears the driver's side radius arm mount by, oh, maybe 1/4 inch, and it hangs down below the frame rail. I hated it being that low, but after 4 years of wheeling it that way it's been a non-issue so I never did anything about it. I sat the whole Bronco down on the transfer case a couple of times on the Rubicon. It barely scraped the case. On less difficult trails other stuff hits long before the transfer case. Oh well. Just one data point...

 

[DanWheeler]

That looks exactly like the factory TPS on my Explorer throttle body. My throttle body has a flat blade on the end of the shaft that engages the plastic fins inside the TPS. Is your throttle body different?

As for your Atlas hanging too low, mine's clocked (I think) one position up from lowest. The t-case clears the driver's side radius arm mount by, oh, maybe 1/4 inch, and it hangs down below the frame rail. I hated it being that low, but after 4 years of wheeling it that way it's been a non-issue so I never did anything about it. I sat the whole Bronco down on the transfer case a couple of times on the Rubicon. It barely scraped the case. On less difficult trails other stuff hits long before the transfer case. Oh well. Just one data point...

i'm still carbureted so this is a bit of a retrofit. What year explorer do you have? Maybe I can hit the junkyard and find a piece that slips into that TPS so I dont have to fabricate something.

 

[lars]

i'm still carbureted so this is a bit of a retrofit. What year explorer do you have? Maybe I can hit the junkyard and find a piece that slips into that TPS so I dont have to fabricate something.

I'm a little slow on the uptake. Sounds like you are installing the TPS on a carburetor to give the Baumanator something to talk to? If so, hmmm...

One option might be to hit a yard and find an EFI Ford. mid to late 90's is probably best. Seems to me the bolt pattern for the TPS is identical on most of them. Then hack up the throttle body to get (a) a nice mounting surface for the TPS and (b) a nice machined rod (the butterfly shaft) to turn it. A little redneck machining with a saw, etc. would probably make for a semi-decent adapter when you were done.

 

[lars]

OK, question for you: if you have a chance I'd be interested in knowing the length from mating surface on the 4R70W bellhousing to the back face of the rear driveshaft yoke on your Atlas. Just curious.

Thanks in advance!

 

[DanWheeler]

lots of progress tonight. Got the torque converter installed and transmission bolted to the engine.

Started working on designing the crossmember and found it will just be easiest to use the stock crossmember. Drilled 2 holes in it to accept the stock Explorer transmission mount.

I'm not really sure how high to put my rear output shaft. Obviously higher is better for clearance but I dont want to cause driveshaft angle issues.

New transmission mounts. They use the existing 4 holes. You can only see the lower right bolt in this picture.

Stupid ford explorer transmission mount studs are metric:

thats a 90s Ford explorer front driveshaft in that last picture. It's about 26" Atlas yoke to D44 yoke. The explorer front driveshaft can't quite go that short.

The rear Atlas yoke to 9" yoke is about 30.5". The Explorer front driveshaft should work in the rear temporarily.